[MD] A formalised Code of Art

[Squonkonguitar at aol.com]

Hello everyone

Hi Mark

The poem we're discussing is a zen  poem.
 
Mark 15-10-06b: Hello Dan.
I've tried to track this poem down but i can't find it anywhere.
Can you help?
If this is a Zen poem it doesn't change the circumstances of culture the  
Buddha was born into.

Dan:
Support for what? You're the one saying RMP  is wrong, not me.
 
Mark 15-10-06b: It's a suggestion. I'm not 100% certain.
And before this gets out of hand, may i remind you precisely what i am  
uncertain about?
1. The poem. (I've not been able to track it down. I mistakenly referred to  
it as a Buddhist poem in previous posts, but it is referred to as a,  'famous' 
poem in Lila)
2. The MoQ translation of the poem.
OK so far Dan?
A. If Lila is, 'Intellectually she's nowhere' (Lila) then she can't kill  
intellectual patterns. And yet, the MoQ translation is introduced at the point  
where Lila's need for ritual is being discussed.
B. The culture the Buddha was born in to is lacking in intellectual  patterns 
- it is a culture of severe religious rituals - so one may question why  the 
Buddha would advocate, in MoQ terms, killing intellectual patterns.
Now then, i have made a mistake, because apparently this poem is not part  of 
the Pali canon!
For this i apologise. I've been a source of confusion and it stinks.
Having said that, we are still left with the poem's relationship to  Lila.
 
Dan:
I should think 
it is up to you to provide support. Just read LILA and  you will have my 
support. Let's have a vote. Does Mark owe us some support  here? All in 
favor, raise your hands...
 
Mark 15-10-06b: I see. Kangaroo court time is it?
And while we're at it, those wishing to vote may like to comment on my  
ability, or lack of, to construct a fair argument, even if it turns  out to be a 
hill of beans. dmb has reservations about this poem's MoQ  translation and has 
expressed his willingness to lend agreement.
Please, let's not turn this into a shouting match.
 
<snip>

>Mark 15-10-06: All i'm saying is the Buddha  utilised intellectual patterns.
>He also stressed one see for oneself -  empirical  experience.

Dan:
We agree.
 
Mark 15-10-06b: There. That wasn't too bad was it?

>Mark  15-10-06: Simple: The early Buddhist teachings - those said to be  the
>Pali canon - utilise intellectual patterns to undermine social  patterns.
>They did so in a particular cultural setting which to a great  degree shape
>them in the first place.
>This is not to say don't  have value in other cultural  contexts.

Dan:
Yes but that isn't to what the poem refers.
 
Mark 15-10-06b: It seems you are correct. I thought the poem was referred  to 
as a Buddhist poem in Lila, but it is referred to as a famous poem.
I've tried to track it down but can't find it.
If the poem had been something the Buddha said, my arguments still  stand.
And, they apply to Lila, who lacks intellectual patterns - she can't kill  
that which she does not have.
Questions still remain regarding the MoQ translation of the  poem.

>Mark 15-10-06: It seems to me you enjoy passing yourself off as  a 500
>book-a-year polymath and sage with Craig Sterling like powers to  assimilate
>information, who can read a page almost as fast as he turns  it. Well, i 
>would
>suggest moving up from the 'Janet and John'  blue book series and give, 
>'Spot's
>first Christmas' a  go.

Dan:
Hey, anyone can learn to speed read, or haven't you heard? And  you're the 
one who has several academic degrees, right? Mark, Mark, Mark.  Don't you 
know I love you? Why are you being like this to me? You're going  to make me 
cry. Is that what you want?
 
Mark 15-10-06b: One degree Dan. I've told you a Million times to stop  
exaggerating.

>ps remember boys and girls: drugs are   wrong!
>
>Mark 15-10-06: Where the hell has this come from  Dan?

Dan:
Platt's peyote smoking. Yeah I know I am cross posting but as they  say in 
France... mangez mes shorts. At least I'm not sending 187 posts a  day... 
right?

Mark 15-10-06b: Am i to take it you regard me as some sort of Platt  figure?
Goodness gracious!
Love,
Mark