[MD] Quantum weirdness

[Hamilton Priday]

Hi Ron --

You and Case are demonstrating the truth of the title 'Quantum weirdness'. 
The only thing weirder is the concepts dreamed up by the Quantum theorists.

[Case]:
> It makes no sense to think of cause when there is no space or time.
> This alone suggests that cause it not infinite as it has a starting point.

[Ron]:
> But Why then does it not exist that way now?
> This is what stumps me.

What Case is saying is that CAUSE is not infinite; you're confused because 
you assume that cause equates to SOURCE.  Cause and effect can be ascribed 
to everything that happens in existence, beginning and ending with 
nothingness, if the law of entropy still holds.  However, this says nothing 
about the Source of existence which, like you, I regard as infinite (and 
absolute).

Also, Case sees Creation as a causal phenomenon, namely one that is 
initiated by the Big Bang and that can be mathematically traced to this 
event.  He doesn't recognize Creation as constant and ongoing.  To him it 
means simply "getting the ball rolling".  He thinks all succeeding events 
are determined by the initial cause.
In fact he says:
> whatever "caused" the big bang or whatever "happened before" it
> has no causal impact in our world.  Space and time for us start at
> that point.  It is the first cause.

A "physicist" like Case should know that an explosion requires energy and 
matter, and therefore cannot be the primary cause.  Yet, he's stuck in the 
objectivist quandary which is the inability to explain where the primordial 
energy came from.  For him reality is physical -- an objective otherness 
that the physicists will eventually "figure out" by inventing new 
dimensions.  When he complains about "all that 'stuff arising the moment' 
negation of essence, being awareness BS", he's admitting that there is no 
subject in his reality.  According to Case, "It makes no sense to think of 
cause when there is no space or time."

I believe you have moved beyond physicality and see the need for a 
metaphysical source that is foreign to Case's objectivist construct.  For 
example, I suspect you understand that time didn't really begin 14 billion 
years ago; it began the moment you became aware of change (most probably at 
some indeterminate stage in your prenatal development).  Time is man's mode 
of awareness, not an attribute of an external reality.

Without subjective awareness there would be no physical world.  This has to 
be true if, as you believe, the ultimate cause (source) is infinite.  What 
use would the absolute source have for evolution in time?  This is man's 
perspective, and it is relative to everything he experiences.  But man is a 
finite creature alienated from absolute reality.  He doesn't perceive things 
absolutely, he experiences them incrementally, as a sequence of events in 
time.  And, because of his finite limitations, he intellectualizes his 
reality perspective as an evolutionary process.

The truth is that existence is a process of his own creation.  But you're 
not going to sell that to Case because he's mired in the mathematical 
probability of experienced events that have no place in ultimate reality. 
That's why he says metaphysical concepts, "the kind of thing Ham does is 
just passing mental gas."  Have some pity on Case though, Ron; he's never 
going to solve this enigma through physics, and he knows it.  (Besides, it's 
much more fun to insult your opponent.)

Cheers,
Ham