[MD] The SOM/MOQ discrepancy.

[Platt Holden]

Ham --

Some quotes in answer to your queries:

[Ham} 
> Now, this contradicts your assertion that "betterness is the fundamental
> creative force."  For if DQ is primary and moves everything to
> "betterness" 
> there is no option for "worseness".  Why then do we experience decadence,
> suffering, and corruption, and why do we have perpetrators of evil in the
> human community?  In other words, if morality is a cosmic principle, how
> can 
> immorality exist in a moral universe?

"If you eliminate suffering from this world you eliminate life. There's no
evolution Those species that don't suffer don't survive. Suffering is the 
negative face of the Quality that drives the whole process." (Lila, 29)


> Moral choices are of course based
> on 
> value preferences.

"The Metaphysics of Quality says that if moral judgments are essentially 
assertions of value and if value is the fundamental ground-stuff of the 
world, then moral judgments are the fundamental ground-stuff of the world."
(Lila, 12)

>  I maintain that we live in an amoral universe but
> invent 
> morality for our collective survival.  As my morality specialist, do you
> still find fault with this concept?

"So what Phaedrus was saying was that not just life, but everything, is an 
ethical activity. It is nothing else. When inorganic patterns of reality 
create life the Metaphysics of Quality postulates that they've done so 
because it's "better" and that this definition of "betterness"-this 
beginning response to Dynamic Quality-is an elementary unit of ethics upon 
which all right and wrong can be based." (Lila, 12)

> I don't know what Pirsig has to say about individual freedom and "free 
> choice", or if he even acknowledges its value.  Perhaps you can provide a
> relevant quote to enlighten me.

"It (the MOQ) says that what is meant by 'human rights' is usually the 
moral code of intellect-vs.-society, the moral right of intellect to be 
free of social control. Freedom of speech; freedom of assembly, of travel; 
trial by jury; habeas corpus; government by consent-these 'human rights' 
are all intellect-vs.-society issues. According to the Metaphysics of 
Quality these 'human rights' have not just a sentimental basis, but a 
rational, metaphysical basis. They are essential to the evolution of a 
higher level of life from a lower level of life. They are for real." 
(Lila, 24)

Finally, there's this quote early on in Lila that brings you and Pirsig 
very close to one another in your respective metaphysics:

"Their overall subject he called a "Metaphysics of Quality," or sometimes a 
"Metaphysics of Value" . . ." (Lila, 2)

You seem to have no problem connecting values with morals. Now if you could 
just take your value-rich metaphysics and inject it with dose of universal 
morality, you and Pirsig could become bosom buddies.

Until that happens, I will have to substitute as a matchmaker. :-)

Always a pleasure, 
Platt