[MD] The percolating SOL

[MarshaV]

RMP:  

"I think it's better to say that time is a static intellectual concept that
is one of the very first to emerge from Dynamic Quality. That keeps Dynamic
Quality concept-free..."

"The MOQ starts with the source of undifferentiated perception itself as the
ultimate reality. The very first differentiation is probably `change`. The
second one may be `before and after`. From this sense of `before and after`
emerge more complex concepts of time."[32]

  (The Role of Evolution, Time and Order in Pirsig's "Metaphysics of
Quality)




-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org] On Behalf Of Ham Priday
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 6:24 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] The percolating SOL

David --

> Ham said:
> There remains, however, the question: What IS the cause of Value?
>
> dmb says:
> When someone answers that, I'll ask about the cause of
> the cause of value. Then somebody can ask about the
> cause of the cause of the cause of value. And so on, forever.
> Just as in the case of theology's "prime mover" or "first cause",
> it's a goofy, goofy fake problem.

It is a "goofy fake problem" only for those who cannot see their way out of 
the fallacy of infinite regression.   Since they have no answer to "What 
caused the Big Bang?" or "What created Consciousness?", they refuse to 
regard the concept of a primary cause as valid.  And so it remains a 
metaphysical problem.

Empirical reality is understood as a cause-and-effect system, the "effects" 
seen as a series of events occurring in time.  This presumes that dimensions

like time and space are fundamental to reality, rather than the relational 
mode of finite experience.  Yet experience has to be the impediment in our 
understanding, as logic does not support the view that the first instance of

anything is "uncaused".  It is man's intellectual bias, not logic, which 
rejects the idea of a "first cause" because it's associated with theology.

When we free ourselves from religious bias and adversity to metaphysics, it 
becomes clear that everything in existence is a "creation", and that 
phenomena which have no causal explanation can only be accounted for by an 
"uncreated source" that is not limited by existential conditions such as 
time, space, and evolution.  Regrettably, despite all their talk about the 
short-sightedness of SOM thinking, MoQ's author and his followers are 
unwilling to seek understanding beyond finitude.

Essentially speaking,
Ham

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