[MD] neener neener

[Steven Peterson]

Hi John,

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:49 PM, John Carl <ridgecoyote at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey steve,
>
> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 3:50 PM, Steven Peterson <peterson.steve at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>
>> Steve:
>> >> Most people don't
>> >> spend much if any time doing philosophy, but all people (withe the
>> >> exception of the mentally impaired) engage in some intellectual
>> >> activity.
>> >>
>>
>> John:
>> > Does watching tv count?  Cuz unless it does, I disagree.
>>
>> Steve:
>> Are you saying that you think watching TV counts as doing philosophy?
>> If so, this is a very unusual position that needs some defending.
>>
>>
> I meant that unless you count watching tv as intellectual activity, most
> people don't ever do it (intellectual activity)
>
> Ok, it's a bit extreme.  But you did say "all people" and I think true
> intellectual activity is rare.  Sure, we see lots of it around here, and
> maybe if you live and work at a University you'll see some.  But elsewhere
> in our lives?   Ron posited some weeks ago that this 4th level patterning is
> actually quite rare. Most people do not reflect upon "reflecting upon" and
> get irritated if you do it around them.


Steve:
You were annoyed and accused me of being condecending when I walked
you through my reasoning of why SOM is not the gateway to intellect,
yet though you followed me step by step, you still came to the
opposite conclusion, so I thought the misconception may be that you
had extended intellect too far into activity such as watching TV. It
now seems clear that you have rather defined intellect too narrowly
when you restrict intellectual activity to "reflecting about
reflecting." Pirsig uses intellect as "simply thinking" rather than
"thinking about thinking." Thinking about thinking is philosophy, the
high country of the mind, and one brand of philosophy is metaphysics,
so it now makes sense that you could think that metaphysics as first
philosophy is the gateway to intellect. This is one of the same
mistakes (one of several) that Bo makes in defining the 4th level as
the SOL. Suggesting that one must first engage in philosophical
thought before one can participate in other intellectual patterns is
backward. Philosophical thought is indeed rare, but everyone
participates in intellectual patterns. One must first be able to think
before thinking about thinking.

Best,
Steve