[MD] The whole yin yang thing

[MarshaV]

On Aug 28, 2010, at 3:21 PM, John Carl wrote:

> Ok, Marsha,  I have no idea how to proceed in a dialogue which always ends
> in the same formulation.
> Neither do I have a clue how to proceed when rationality is rejected.

Not rejected, but understood to be flawed.  


> My instincts, intuition and all just seem to whisper to me, "this
> conversation isn't going anywhere."

We agree.
   

> My instincts tell me that you are being over-defensive, and any guess I
> publish as to why, gets immediately shot down by you as false projection on
> my part.

That would depend if you made a false projection.   



> You post "victory" and "winning an argument" as  very important to you and
> thus I guess I'll just concede that your superior reasoning (or is it
> non-reasoning?  

You could never be a loser in my eyes.   


> I admit I'm confused) goes right over my head, and I'll take
> your word for it that the last word to any discussion, speculation or query
> is not this, not that.
> 
> You win!

No me to win.   

> 
> Yay Marsha!

Boo Marsha if seems the winner.   


> 
> I'd never stick a sock in anyone's mouth.  I'm not a violent, forceful
> type.  My leaning is to stick the sock in my own mouth.

I am biting my tongue.   


> Take care,
> 
> John

You take care too,

Marsha, who is not this, not that...    







> 
> On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 2:08 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On Aug 27, 2010, at 5:15 PM, John Carl wrote:
>> 
>>> Marsha,
>>> 
>>> It seems to me if the MoQ can't extricate us out of the mire of
>> relativism,
>>> we're gonna be really stuck.  I think it does get us out by encouraging
>> us
>>> to keep trying.  Since we both take as given that Quality is real, we
>> both
>>> have hope of realizing it in unison when we come across it or create it
>> via
>>> dialogue.
>> 
>> 
>> John,
>> 
>> What you state as "the mire of relativism", I experience as
>> everything-is-connected-to-everything, which is also expressed
>> in the words "no this, not that'.
>> 
>> 
>> Marsha
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 1:13 PM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> John,
>>>> 
>>>> Isn't your system based on correcting faulty reasoning?   Whether
>>>> yes or no, where would insight, feeling, intuition and esthetics
>>>> fit into this process?  Feels right to me may never feel right to you,
>>>> but then you might claim victory based on rationality.   Where is
>>>> the irrational or superrational a part of the system?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Victory?  The object of a finite game is to win, but this game is in no
>> way
>>> finite or limitable.  It's intrinsically an infinite interpretation.
>>> 
>>> The way I think feelings and intuition fit into the process, is that we
>>> experience such, and then share that experience with each other.
>> Sometimes,
>>> my experience doesn't translate easily.  But with time and effort, I
>> think
>>> most any feeling or intuition can be shared verbally.  I know what you
>> mean,
>>> about the feeling itself, but really we're not trying to feel each
>> other's
>>> feelings.  We're trying to understand each other's intellectual
>>> understandings of our feelings.
>>> 
>>> Of course, intellect is just a small part of our human experience.  But
>>> nevertheless, it's an important aspect and worthy of the attempt to get
>> it
>>> right.  And even with its limitations we have no other way of
>> communicating.
>>> 
>>> Doesn't that seem right to you?
>>> 
>>> John
>>> 
>>> PS: I take it you meant "how very rational" in a derogatory way then.
>>> Criticism of using rationality doesn't make any more sense to me than
>>> criticism of my use of English or my use of interpretation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I can accept that my interpretation is invalid because it's lazy and
>>>>>>> cliched.    I can't accept its invalid simply because it's an
>>>>>>> interpretation.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> To me, the process has to go like this: I project, you correct.  You
>>>>>>> project, I correct.  We keep going till it feels right.  We don't
>> quit
>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> because it feels wrong.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> John
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> How very rational!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Marsha
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 11:34 PM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> John,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I reject your interpretations here.  Your conclusions seem to me
>> like
>>>>>> lazy
>>>>>>>> cliche.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ___
>>>>>> 
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