[MD] now it comes

[skutvik at online.no]

Adrie, Marsha. DMB, All.

24 July you quoted from a Buchanan post to Marsha without adding 
any comments. Anyway from chapter 28 of ZAMM:

    Now it comes! Because Quality is the generator of the mythos. 
    That's it. That's what he meant when he said, "Quality is the 
    continuing stimulus which causes us to create the world in 
    which we live. All of it. Every last bit of it." Religion isn't 
    invented by man. Men are invented by religion. Men invent 
    responses to Quality, and among these responses is an 
    understanding of what they themselves are. You know 
    something and then the Quality stimulus hits and then you try 
    to define the Quality stimulus, but to define it all you've got to 
    work with is what you know. So your definition is made up of 
    what you know. It's an analogue to what you already know. It 
    has to be. It can't be anything else. And the mythos grows this 
    way. By analogies to what is known before. The mythos is a 
    building of analogues upon analogues upon analogues. These 
    fill the collective consciousness of all communicating mankind. 
    Every last bit of it. The Quality is the track that directs the train. 
    What is o ut side the train, to either side...that is the terra 
    incognita of the insane. He knew that to understand Quality he 
    would have to leave the mythos. That's why he felt that 
    slippage. He knew something was about to happen.  


Fist of all a little caution when using ZAMM. In that book there were 
just one single static fallout (level) from Dynamic Quality, namely the 
Subject/Object distinction - SOM - or INTELLECT (that Phaedrus also 
called it) thus us "inventing responses to Quality" necessarily becomes 
" theories about existence". But the full-fledged MOQ takes at least 
one seven-league step up from that to the postulate that existence 
itself is several responses to Quality, that the UNIVERSE itself is the 
first response and that mankind only enters the picture until near the 
top layer of the second response - the BIOLOGICAL. Do you 
understand? 

Now, from this MOQ perspective to go back to the 4th. level's S/O- 
perspective where man's mind is the creator of all theories about 
existence is disaster, and this is the "sly writings of DMB" I call  when 
he from MOQ's perspective suddenly changes to intellect's where the 
fundamental metaphysical slash no longer is between DQ and SQ but 
DQ and concepts and he refers to various American thinkers having 
anticipated Pirsig. We have one prominent "intellectual" thinker - Ham 
Priday - who claims the human subject as the obvious beginning point, 
but he has never claimed to be a MOQist and is innocent, but DMB is 
much more dangerous by claiming to have received Pirsg's blessings 
yet does MOQ so much harm by his MOQ-Intellect confusion.             

DMB
> > Don't you see how this goes so neatly with the explanations in Lila?
> > The relationship between subjects and objects simply is not the same
> > as the relationship between dynamic reality and static concepts
> > (between DQ and sq).

To what Marsha most correctly replied

> I agree, and so does Bo.  

Right, who claims that the S/O relationship is the same as the DQ/SQ 
one? And moreover who says that SQ are "static concepts"? except 
DMB. It is inorganic, biological, social  and intellectual patterns, only at 
intellect is it reality vs concepts and if this SOM's is equalized with 
DQ/SQ all hell is loose as it has been long in the weak camp.  

Bodvar