[MD] Re Arlo

[skutvik at online.no]

Andy, Arlo. Andre (also commented it) Platt, All. 

26 July Andy wrote:

> Yea, Arlo. The MoQ is an intellectual pattern, a static latching point
> reached by Pirsig after a Dynamic forward leap. It is a map of
> territory. To say that a map of Austin is a subset of a map of Texas is
> not to invoke recursion, even if you are standing in Austin looking at
> the map of Texas. 

The MOQ being an intellectual pattern is forbidden by logic. The 4th. 
level is a MOQ creation, subset, property ... whatever, and cannot 
contain the system that contains itself (Pirsig's container logic) without 
severe logical loops and recurrence as Platt points to. 

The MOQ profess to resolve this SOM-induced  paradox (the alleged 
objective reality is a property of the alleged subjective mind)  but Andy 
and Arlo are keen to pollute the MOQ with SOM and its paradoxes and 
uses the Reality/Map allegory for all it is worth to promote their somish 
point that the MOQ only exists in our minds. 

Pirsig doesn't really speak about maps as such in LILA but about the 
problem of projecting a globe on to a flat sheet of paper and that a 
polar projection is the thing to use in those regions and a Mercator 
projection elsewhere, but the reality/map has become exhibit # 1 for a 
the weak interpreters in the MOQ-an-intelletual-pattern issue. 

No one holding a sheet of paper will claim that IT is the terrain but as 
every schoolboy knows, maps can be enlarged and at scale 1 :1 the 
map and the terrain merges. No one will claim the book LILA is reality 
but principally it can be "enlarged" infinitely and nowhere is there a 
boundary between it and reality, but - again - the bone Andy and Arlo 
gnaw on is that the MOQ is in our minds and regardless - like in SOM - 
can it become matter. 

They are like the scientist (in a film I once saw)  with an "illness" in a 
test tube and when it was robbed from him pleaded "Please let me 
have my illness back" They will not give up the SOM at any price.

Bodvar             







 
> On Jul 26, 2010 10:36 AM, "ARLO J BENSINGER JR" <ajb102 at psu.edu>
> wrote:
> 
> [Platt]
> By making the intellectual level a subset of the MOQ, thereby avoiding
> the disharmony of rec... [Arlo] Disharmony in recursion?! Tell that to
> Escher! Or Goedel! Or Bach!!
> 
> All "metaphysics", of any kind, ALL descriptions of reality are a
> subset of the reality they describe. The MOQ is no different. It is
> not apart from the reality it describes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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