[MD] The Level of Intellectual Quality

[Louise Pryor]

Hi Dan,

Dan:
> The thing about becoming better is there is no way to do it other than
> doing it. I don't need to hear anything from anyone. I just know. And
> so do you whether you care to admit it or not.
>

It's true that there is no way to do it other than doing it, BUT, there is
also no way
to change until I am ready to change, and that only comes about through a
whole
lot of input from differing sources simmering away in my brain until it's
boiled down
to the thing it needs to be for me. If I didn't hear anything from anyone
else, then
how would I ever know to think differently, or to think anything, for that
matter?

>

>Lu:
> > It seems that on a metaphysical discussion group, you would find the
> > majority with this view - openness to discourse. It is threatening to
> most
> > folks out in the world, to have their ideology and worldview challenged.
> > Here, though, it should be a safe place to bring it ALL up. A LOT of
> people
> > believe in a god of some sort. To just chuck out any conversation
> including
> > allusions to deity or theism is to exclude a lot of interesting
> discussion.
>
> Dan:
>
> What a load of crap. A lot of people watch television too. What does
> that tell you about a lot of people? And I'm supposed to listen to
> them? Why? And I'm sorry to say it but I find most people dull and
> decidedly uninteresting, that's one reason I hang out here.
>

Ooh, got me in my pet peeve - television. Yes, a lot of people watch and are
becoming
a lot less interesting all the time. However, I am not suggesting listening
to *them*, I
suggest that we converse, interact and listen to people who are interested
in deeper things.
That's why I am here, too.

>
> Dan:
>
> My oldest daughter got married about four years ago. Her and her new
> husband lived in Utah at the time. They invited me to the wedding. I
> dislike flying so I drove for two days to get there. Now... imagine if
> you will being told you can't attend your daughter's wedding because
> you're not a Mormon. Non-believers are not allowed inside their
> temple.
>
> So. Lucky me got to attend the civil ceremony the next day at the
> local community center. And my in-laws treated me like I was some kind
> of low-life. They kept calling each other "brother" and "sister" while
> all the time ignoring me. Christ. They wouldn't even look me in the
> eye. I did a prayer for all of them in that afternoon's meditation.
>
> Theism leaves a bad taste in my mouth. People start believing they
> know best and whoever disagrees, they first try to convert them. That
> failing, they shun the non-believers. Name me one theistic religion
> that doesn't, please. They're all the same in that regard. Atheists
> are nearly as bad. Don't even get me started with that.
>
>
But don't you see? What you are arguing against here is not theism so much
as it is religion.
theism |ˈθēˌizəm|nounbelief in the existence of a god or gods, esp. belief
in one god as creatorof the universe, intervening in it and sustaining a
personal relation to his creatures. Compare with deism .
I have the same reaction to those exclusive clubs called churches. Pretty
much any time I go
(which is not often) I leave fuming about something. But, my disagreements
with religion and religious
people have led to amazing conversations and profound realizations - not the
lessons the preacher had
in mind, though.

I consider myself a "seeker of truth". I look at it like this;

Once upon a time, there was a seeker of truth who stumbled upon a path and
realized that,
"Hey, this path leads to truth!" So he recruited others to follow the same
path, and it became an
entrenched highway, that worked ok, for most people, for a while. At least
they didn't have to look so hard
 for "truth", it was all laid out pretty handy for them, but... in
actuality, there is only one path for
each of us, our paths may parallel, or cross, or intersect for a while, but
each path is intensely personal,
and to try to make your path work for me is a mistake, and lazy, and that is
the point at which a path turns into a religion.
Most people are lazy, though, and would rather follow a religion than try to
find truth on their own.

>
> Dan:
>
> Well, from the look of things your man has gotten over his
> discouragement, what with dmb playing nice and all. I'm glad. And
> don't worry. I won't be able to post here again any time soon.
> Priorities, don't you know.
>
> Be Good,
>
> Well, I'll try! Please don't stay away too long.

Lu