[MD] socialism

[John Carl]

Well it's an interesting debate.  What do you mean by "pattern"?  Is a
pattern created by the mind that observes it?

Then it's all in your head and without observation, doesn't exist.

Is a pattern a "thing" floating out there waiting to be recognized?  Then
that's objectivism or SOM  or realism, all denigrated by the MoQ.

Patterning is then, equivalent to Quality,   Thus by the MoQ light,
unpatterned=non-existent.

 I think  you use "unpatterned" to designate "non-intellectual".  I agree
that non-intellectual awareness exists, but I don't agree that "unpatterned
awareness" makes any sense.

Now that I consider this argument, it seems to me that if we could clear up
the distinction between patterning and intellectualizing, we'd clear up the
issue of the 4th level being SOM.

Sounds good to me!  Let's do it.


J

On Mon, May 31, 2010 at 8:35 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:

>
> On May 31, 2010, at 10:59 AM, John Carl wrote:
>
> > I just have to say this every now and then as a reminder of sanity:
> >
> > There's no such thing as "unpatterned experience".  All experience is a
> > pattern.
>
> John,
>
> Say it all you want, but I disagree.
>
> If there are no patterns slapped on experience you have unpatterned
> experience.  One can, with full awareness, see without recognizing
> form or color or anything else.  That is what I am calling unpatterned
> experience.
>
> Maybe you think I'm meaning something more spectacular?  It's like
> awareness full on, mind full off.
>
>
> Marsha
>
>
>
> >
> > There's no such thing as "undifferentiated awareness".  All awareness is
> > differentiation.
> >
> >
> > There.  I feel better now.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Sometimes experience is beyond making sense.
> >>
> >>
> >> Marsha
> >>
> >>
> > True!  But just because a pattern is not recognized as "sense", doesn't
> mean
> > its not a pattern anyway.
> >
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >>
> >>
> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list
> >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> >> Archives:
> >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
> >>
> > Moq_Discuss mailing list
> > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> > Archives:
> > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> > http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>
>
>
> ___
>
>
> Moq_Discuss mailing list
> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> Archives:
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>