[MD] US democracy at work?

[Andre Broersen]

Ian said:

I thought the original point was about the former, the practical workings of a democracy,...

Andre:
Yes Ian , this was the issue I raised. What stunned me was the apparently, planned and coordinated effort of one party to (sneakily) bypass some of the principles upon which a democracy is based i.e. sabotaging the ability of the 'opposition' to exercise control over matters affecting the interests of those they represent by upholding the principle of fairness, reasonable argumentation and persuasion. It seems to me these everyday [political] practices were denied. Perhaps, as far as politics is concerned I am too naive eh?

I understand the reasoning...same things as for example Horse outlined is happening here as well. Health care insurance here in the Netherlands is compulsory (for both private and public employees). Contributing to a Pension fund is compulsory for public servants (with no choice of which fund). Private employees are encouraged (as Dan suggested)to contribute to a Pension fund to ensure for extra provisions after retirement as well and one would be a fool not to do so.

Without the 'extra' the basic social security pay upon retirement is enough to throw you close to the poverty line.

But the current uncertainties regarding levels of pensions and accumulated benefits (agreed upon originally) are the result of the financial crisis and financial mismanagement (bad investments) done by pension funds themselves. Two important issues are playing here: the fact that you have to contribute (their compulsory nature) and the claim, which they have maintained since their inception, that contributions are guaranteed safe.

The realization that pension funds are NOT guaranteed and safe has made lots of people very angry. May as well have made a regular (voluntary) contribution into an investment fund (where you are aware of some of the risks). Now, most pension funds have been exposed as being no better than investment funds... and a bit less smart.

This has resulted in a loss of trust, of course by many people in their 'own' funds (not to mention their own banks but that is a slightly different issue) and, relating it back to the US again, I can therefore imagine (as Dan points out as well) that many people are very angry at this 'incident' in Wisconsin where people's political representatives have been sidelined in a most sneaky way.


Cheers