[MD] The Relativist's journey

[MarshaV]

Mark,

There are serious questions, from me and to you, in this post.  They are the sentences with the questions marks at the end.   -  What do you think words are for?  What are you searching for?  What 'facade' are you talking about?  How does the concept of 'unreal' enter into this dialogue?  -  You have generally been ignoring the questions I have presented to you for a long time.  I no longer take your posts to be serious, and no longer feel the need to answer any of them.  

Btw, Quality may be compared to quantum theory's non-locality.  Static quality exists in stable patterns relative to (that's relative to) other patterns, where patterns have no independent existence.  No hidden variables, only Quality.  


Marsha  




On Nov 25, 2011, at 3:17 PM, MarshaV wrote:

> 
> 
> Marsha,
> 
> On Nov 25, 2011, at 2:10 PM, 118 wrote:
> 
>> 
>> Mark:
>> This is fun.
> 
> Marsha:
> I suspect a mild form of insanity.   
> 
> 
>> On Nov 25, 2011, at 9:44 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> On Nov 25, 2011, at 12:05 PM, 118 wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi Marsha,
>>> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> Well I guess this begs the question "where is the real?".
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> You brought the words "real thing" into the conversation.  When I wrote "There is no real thing.", I could be considering that you meant the word "thing" in an independent, objective sense, or I could be questioning your use of "real" as in an Absolute sense, or both.  Or maybe I should have disregarded your post,,, again.  
>> 
>> Mark:
>> I suppose I should ask you "independent" from what?  We use the word "objective" to imply detached.  I will agree that we are not detached, and that the word can be dropped if you want.  It is often used rhetorically to provide a meaningful split between the "subjective" and the "objective".  Is this split meaningless to you?  If so, I can avoid using it.  However, if we start to simplify language, the color it brings turns to shades of grey.
> 
> Marsha:
> I have no idea what you are talking about.
> 
> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> Words are symbols, but perhaps what words convey outside the symbology is real.  
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> Haven't the slightest idea what this means.  
>> 
>> Mark:
>> OK, then let me ask the following thought question: What are words used for?  This may give a better idea.
> 
> Marsha:
> I do not know for certain.  What do you think?  
> 
> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> If one lives in an unreal world, one is always searching.  
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> I live in a provisional, static world interacting with DQ to a varying degree.  I am sorry you are "always searching."  
>>> 
>> IMark:
>> f your world is provisional, what is it provisional to?
> 
> Marsha:
> I should have said I live in a conventional, static world.  
> 
> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> Such searching is also considered unreal, and meaningfulness is lost.  
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> What are you searching for?   
>> 
>> Mark:
>> Many things, but the right here right now is real to me.  I see no reason to hide it as if there were something more.  It would seem that you operate within a fake world.  If a word is not real, then what is it?  If provisionality is not real, then where do you find yourself?
> 
> Marsha:
> I meant provincial or conventional world.  What _seems to you_ about me is your problem because I cannot related to anything you've written.  
> 
> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> What has meaning to you?  
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> It's all Value(Dynamic/static).  
>> 
>> Mark:
>> Is Value Real to you, or is there something contingent to Value or Quality?
> 
> Marsha: 
> I might repeat the positive tetralemma that Jay Garland put together:
> 
> Everything is _conventionally_ real.
> Nothing is _Ultimately_ real.
> Everything is both _conventionally_ real and _Ultimately_ unreal.
> Nothing is either _conventionally_ unreal or _Ultimately_ real.  
> 
> 
>>>> Mark:
>>>> Is there something behind the facade? 
>>> 
>>> Marsha:
>>> What facade?
>> 
>> Mark:
>> When you say unreal it seems to imply a facade.  Is there then no facade?
> 
> Marsha:
> You brought in the word 'unreal'.  Do you mean Ultimately unreal?  Do you know what you mean??? 
> 
> 
> You've ignored my questions.  I've had enough.  This is too boring.   
> 
> 
> Byeeee.   
> 
> 
> Marsha 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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___