[MD] Horse, Is this proper conduct?

[Joseph Maurer]

Hi MarshaV and All,


On 3/16/13 2:01 AM, "MarshaV" <valkyr at att.net> wrote:

> 
> 
> On Mar 15, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joseph  Maurer <jhmau at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Marsha,
>> 
>> If dynamic quality, reality, is unknowable why use the term?
> 
> Are you asking why RMP used language to explain the Metaphysics of Quality?

Hi Marsha

I guess I am stuck in questioning logic!  I do not know how to logically
express the unknowable.  Perhaps through analogy, metaphor, gesture.

> 
> 
>> There is a broad spectrum of the knowable.  What is unknowable describing?
> 
> Since you think it is Dynamic Quality is knowable, you describe it?

There is a difference between the indefinable and the unknowable.  I may not
be able to use defined words to describe an unknowable, but I can use
gesture, analogy, metaphor to achieve some meaning of indefinable reality.
> 
> 
>> Limits of reality or limits of knowledge?
> 
> What are you referring to and in what context?

In Moq metaphysics knowledge is communicated through analogy, metaphor,
gesture for DQ as well as words and definitions of SQ.
 
> 
>> To discuss unknowable reality seems futile.
> 
> Okay.
> 
> 
>> Supposing there is a broad spectrum to the unknowable, how can we discover
>> it?  
> 
> To say the unknowable is a 'broad spectrum' seems to be assuming too much.
> 
Metaphysics accepts the indefinable.  Music, gesture, analogy, metaphor etc.
are some ways to make myself understood.
> 
>> It seems to me discussion and unknowable are at odds unless you accept that
>> indefinable and unknowable are synonymous.
> 
> This might be one way to think about indefinable and unknowable.
> 
> 
>> DQ is indefinable. IMHO Unknowable reality stretches the discussion of DQ
>> metaphysics to a leap of Faith.
> 
> It's a 'leap of faith' that when I wake up in the morning, put my feet on the
> floor and stand up that I won't fall through the flooring.  And?
> 
>  I was trying to open the door to Faith and Reason.

>> I would rather tweak rationality into the experience of indefinable
>> DQ in consciousness rather than accept indefinable DQ as a leap of faith.
> 
> In considering a metaphysics - the nature of reality - I would prefer to dig
> deep rather than settle for tweaking rationality.  I might consider that
> "tweaking rationality" is best handled by holding static patterns of value as
> hypothetical (supposed but not necessarily real or true).
> 
>   
> Marsha

I don't want to abandon truth either!
 
>Joe 
> 
>> 
>> On 3/14/13 4:07 PM, "MarshaV" <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> Greetings Joe,
>>> 
>>> I am perfectly satisfied with understanding the MoQ designating Reality =
>>> Value(Dynamic(indivisible, undefinable and unknowable)/static(divisible,
>>> definable and knowable))  :-)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Marsha 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 4:10 PM, Joseph  Maurer <jhmau at comcast.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi MarshaV,
>>>> 
>>>> I am too old (80 plus) to remember philosophy.  I want to jump immediately
>>>> to an indefinable as the limit on an aging process.  DQ is indefinable,
>>>> always new, so to speak, and I am alive!
>>>> 
>>>> Joe
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 3/13/13 11:30 PM, "MarshaV" <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hello Joe,
>>>>> 
>>>>> I wondered if you might agree with Nietzsche?
>>>>> 
>>>>> "Compared with music all communication by words is shameless; words dilute
>>>>> and brutalize; words depersonalize; words make uncommon common."
>>>>>        (Nietzsche, Friedrich,  'Will To Power')
>>>>> 
>>>>> re fa la
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Marsha
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 3:51 PM, Joseph  Maurer <jhmau at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi MarshaV,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> IMHO How to describe a theory of knowledge in DQ/SQ experience?  DQ,
>>>>>> indefinable self-consciousness along with definable SQ structure, enables
>>>>>> self-directed activity.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> SQ, defined reality, places the limit of definition on an indefinable DQ
>>>>>> emotional self-consciousness.  Definitions aid communication.  Music is a
>>>>>> more immediate less structured communication in its emotional origins.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What is logic?  The Intellect and freewill of activity are tied to a
>>>>>> common
>>>>>> limit, self-awareness.  I can't jump on my horse and ride off in all
>>>>>> directions.  Logic describes limits on knowledge in the structure of self
>>>>>> awareness DQ/SQ.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Music is an harmonious structure, more revealing in some ways in being
>>>>>> less
>>>>>> subject to SQ discipline than logic.  Music evokes more intensity in its
>>>>>> indefinable emotional origins than intellectual logic.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Joe
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 3/13/13 12:40 AM, "MarshaV" <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Schopenhauer believed that the mediations of art in general, but
>>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>>> music, were more directly able to reveal the nature of reality than was
>>>>>>> philosophy.
>>> 
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