[MD] Static Patterns Rock!

[MarshaV]

Andre,


Marsha:
Sorry, but I cannot follow your reasoning and have little interest in your personal opinion.  

I wrote:
The static world is not an illusion, the static world is like an illusion.

    All conditioned dharmas 
    Are like dreams, illusions, bubbles, shadows, 
    Like dew drops and a lightning flash. 
    Contemplate them thus.
              (The Diamond Sutra)


Andre asked: 
Do you believe that the atomic bombs that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were illusory?


Marsha said:
All conceptions and mental images that "atomic bombs that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki" might signify are a counterfeit of the actual event.  It is in this understanding that I say it is "like" an illusion.

Marsha:
Would you like to ask for my moral evaluation this a philosophical isolate?   




Marsha




> On Oct 17, 2013, at 1:32 PM, Andre <andrebroersen at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Marsha to dmb & Andre:
> The purpose of mystic meditation is not to remove oneself from experience but to bring one's self closer to it by eliminating stale, confusing, static, intellectual attachments of the past. " (LILA, Chapter 9)
> 
> I have no direct experience of the atomic bombs that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Tell me what you know of the atomic bombs that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki and how you know it?
> 
> Andre:
> And this is your 'defense' regarding your conditional and hypothetical moral denial (!) of the reality of the dropping of the atomic bombs and the horror called the holocaust? Appealing to your vipassana injunctions?
> 
> The incredible horror of your stance and its implications are beyond your intellectual grasp. You literally fail to comprehend the implications of what you are saying.
> 
> Because you did not have 'direct experience' of it? Bloody hell! Those that DID directly experience it are DEAD Lucy. In your warped and bigoted way of reasoning those few that survived came close but did not have the same direct experience. So what do they know eh? And what did they leave behind for us?
> 
> What a pathetic, morally contemptible response totally at odds with the MoQ. And not only with the MoQ.
> 
> All of the perennial philosophies, all the wisdom traditions, all the saints and sages over the past few millennia who stuck their heads out to teach, advise and assist and write when and where needed. Some were even killed for it. Marsha does not even speak from the perspective of 'the wold of the buddhas'.
> 
> Do you think they did that because they were convinced that sq patterns were 'like an illusion'?
> 
> May as well discuss whether the actions of a Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Mugabe, Idi Amin, Nixon, Bush and many others, (responsible for the killing of over 100 million people during the last century) were 'conditionally', or 'like an illusion' real or not. The promulgation of this sort of reasoning undermines the MoQ to no end and I doubt very much if Pirsig himself is impressed with this (alleged) (ab)use of his MoQ interpretation. And I mention this because she cites Anthony's PhD and Pirsig's writings to legitimize these claims.
> 
> I would go so far as thinking that any poster here on this discuss would find this unacceptable. But, apart from dmb's efforts no-one has reacted.We find ourselves having to defend and justify a moral position that acknowledges mankind's worst atrocities (the very center of some of the moral codes Pirsig identified) as real as rocks and trees and find this position opposed by an anti-intellectualism and subjective solipsism that does not seem to have any bounds. If there is one it is surrounded by egotistical narcissism.
> 
> I urge Horse to take some sort of action. This is doing the Discuss nor Pirsig's MoQ any good. I openly and blatantly request Marsha (in true Lucy form) to be removed from this MoQ discussion site, whether is be temporarily or permanently
>