[MD] Zen at War

[david buchanan]

Dave Thomas said to dmb:
No, you, yet agin, are miss'n or avoid'n the point. It is one half of the whole subject. Pirsig claims roots in Buddhism and James. Marrying these long standing Eastern and Western traditions is his goal.  Y'all don't like how Marsha portrays the Buddhist half. McWatt has formally pictured it elsewhere. Do you like that any better? Do you really understand it? Or you can choose from "About 45,100,000" Google pages to guide you.

dmb says:
I really have no idea what you're trying say here. Are you taking my criticisms of Marsha as a criticism of Buddhism? Do you take my interest in James as a de-emphasis of Buddhism? You think I'm rejecting Buddhism? That's not what I think at all. The perennial philosophy says that all the great traditions have an esoteric, mystical core wherein they are in agreement. And that's what I'm talking about when comparing Zen satori, pure experience and Dynamic Quality. Since Nishida, Suzuki, James and Pirsig are in basic agreement about this mystic reality, a comparative analysis of their terms and descriptions should provide a clearer, richer, deeper understanding of the MOQ.
You're welcome.


 
Dave Thomas said:
Pirsig's axiom that, "Quality is a direct experience independent of and prior to intellectual abstractions." is a "Westernized Koan", directly poached from Buddhism. And as far as I know, Buddhism is the only known "philosophy/religion" that proposes a path, a psychological reconditioning, to actually accomplish this "independent direct experience of Quality." At the end of this path it's claimed that you will directly experience Quality, Reality as it Really is. (You don't do that currently) Now if this sounds more like religion (or pending psychosis) than philosophy, then you have had an enlightening moment. ...But if you must, go for it, I'll be try'n to shine a little non-Dharma light along the way to guide you back to an imperfect, but non-mystical reality.




dmb says:

Oh, so you're the one who doesn't like the Buddhism or the mysticism. Now I'm really confused. 

And no, Zen practices are not the only the only path. Like vision quests or peyote trips, it's just one of the more famous roads. Again, the MOQ, philosophical Buddhism and philosophical mysticism are particular expressions of the perennial philosophy. At one point Pirsig even says the MOQ is an expression of the oldest idea known to man. It's not a contest. It's a comparative analysis, you know?