[MD] "RMP: Ignoramous or fraud?

Thu Nov 3 10:49:22 PDT 2016

Back in the old days, here in Belgium, but especially in The Netherlands
beachcombing was a full time job for a lot of people.The wood that was
washed ashore was highly valued for smoking eels,or for heating of the
house.It is not so long ago that poor people had no heating in their houses.
In Belgium and Holland it was a law for a long time,that when a boat
was abandoned in a storm,the owner/captain lost all rights on it.As well
on the cargo.Beachcombers always knew, when a storm appears......money
was coming in.
They had the right to saw off all the copper from the ships, and the cargo
was theirs along with the casco.
But things chanced, only the state itself has rights on abandoned ships
and cargo's nowaday's .even collecting wood is illegal in modern times.
There was some remnant allowed activity to keep collecting clam's and what
we call "kokkels", (probably Andre will still remember) a sort off
shellfish,and the clams are a sort of geoducks but much smaller(mya
arenaria),and one could actually make a living out of it to harvest and
sell them.

But nowadays one can only collect 10 kilo/day/person.Only for personal
consumption.One of my brother still collects them;he does not like the bag
limit.He goes above it very far. If he will get caught in the act on dutch
soil
it will cost him his car.I always tell him,avoid Holland, stay in Belgium
to collect, but....

But this aside, and adopting the term for metaforical purposes ,Pirsig
is a beachcomber in the intellectual landscape ,beachcombing the giant,
and the world in wich we live, to show wat was laid bare by the storm so to
speak.

My English is rusty nowadays.strange to feel how fast it erodes.
I do not see a heinous quadrillemma, Dan , but maybe there is an upcoming
treadmill for varmint in the make.
Should it be left behind ? or is there a horizon?...what say you?

kind regards.
Adrie

2016-11-02 7:33 GMT+01:00 Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:

> Hi Adrie, all,
>
> On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Dan used a word not so long ago, that nested itself in my mind.
> > I liked the word, the term.I knew it would come in very handy later on.
> > The word was beachcombing.Nobody went along with the story he wanted to
> > tell,on that moment.
> > If properly placed in a philosophical context  it would be a good and
> > usefull tool.
>
> Dan:
> Lots of times I find it useful to clothe philosophical arguments in
> stories. You know, to sort of liven things up a bit. I don't know.
> Maybe that's why Robert Pirsig wrote philosophy in the form of novels.
> Honestly, to me, a lot of philosophy is so dry I feel as if I am
> trekking across a vast arid wasteland and man oh man am I thirsty and
> in the distance I keep seeing what I think are large bodies of water
> maybe lakes or even oceans only when I get closer I realize the water
> I am seeing is only the heat roiling off the land causing a mirage
> making me believe that perhaps I am coming to an end, getting closer
> to the knowledge I seek. But of course there's no crying in baseball
> just like there are no endings in philosophy. Silly me.
>
> I guess I am getting to a point in life where I am old enough to know
> better yet still young enough not to give a... So yeah, beachcombing.
> The ocean is like something eternal, forever washing up tiny treasures
> with each passing day, the tides flowing in and out, the old slowly
> giving way to the new, rocks being broken down to sand over the course
> of eons, glass worn smooth. And every once in a while comes one of
> those big old storms. Like a hurricane. A typhoon. Yeah, I like that
> better. Stirring up the sediment long dormant. Forgotten. Languishing
> at the bottom like miles deep where nobody sees it.
>
> Philosophy is the same way. Every once in a while someone comes along
> and stirs things up. Hurricanes. Typhoons. Cyclones. Oh my. But
> mostly, it's the snorers who dominate the spotlight. When a fellow
> like Robert Pirsig erupts on the scene, the old timers just ignore
> him. No mention whatsoever. Like maybe if they just keep on snoring
> then nobody'll notice how the same old same old just keeps rolling in
> and out of academia and they can keep on teaching their dull and dry
> philosophy 101 read this and conform to that and besides, Pirsig's a
> madman anyhow. He even said so.
>
> Beachcombing. That's what I do, if only metaphorically for now. But
> there are times when I get to thinking how if there is a purpose in
> life a purpose to life and I'm not saying there is, but if there is,
> maybe beachcombing wouldn't be all that bad. Not a terrible thing to
> devote oneself to. Get me a little place close to the beach because
> well I don't have enough money to live on the beach and maybe find me
> a Padma to read over my stuff, you know, someone to tell me how full
> of it I am and not let my head get so big it won't fit through the
> doorway.
>
> A fellow can dream, anyhow. Right?
>
> >
> > maybe we should be beachcombing Whitehead's work,and comparisons like
> > offered on the moq page-(Sneddon),as David is pointing towards.
> > I did only read it diagonally and very fast, but it shows promising
> toughts.
> > I do not really oppose to Whitehead because John persists on him,just
> like
> > he did with Royce in a somewhat compulsive manner.
> > Maybe we should start beachcombing along this Sneddon thesis.....,but
> > this is not the colusseum and we are no gladiators.We should gain
> > something out of it.Improvement. betterness.Progress=>=>=>
> >
> > Dan is very correct if he demands a man needs to know his case,there
> > is no case whatsoever without the correct details.It shows itself in
> remarks
> > about reading Northrop/Whitehead in the bowels of the
> troopship,presenting
> > half-quote's
> > or admitting like tuuk did, that he did not really read Lila.
> >
> > The doll is still to be found whilst beachcombing guys,and nobody here
> > needs to be a professor.
> > But simply stating that the moq is invalid (without reading the work),
> > is drooling all over the place.
> >
> >
> > I really wished that Dan would be still talking about his beachcombing,
> > and found some dialogue.I like irl grounded story's.They tend to be very
> > philosphical.
> >
> > Adrie
> >
> >
> >
> > 2016-11-01 18:51 GMT+01:00 John Carl <ridgecoyote at gmail.com>:
> >
> >> And admittedly, I was trying to get a rise out of y'all.  So at least
> that
> >> worked.  Thanks dmb for the link to the comparison by Sneddon.  Very
> >> helpful.
> >>
> >> jc
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 10:50 AM, John Carl <ridgecoyote at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> > My apologies.  I'm getting old I guess, I thought it was Whitehead but
> >> > you're right Andre of course Andre.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > sheesh, how embarrasing.  I guess we all know who the REAL ignoramus
> is.
> >> >
> >> > mea culpa
> >> >
> >> > John
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Oct 29, 2016 at 7:47 AM, Andre Broersen <
> andrebroersen at gmail.com
> >> >
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> John:
> >> >> So "ignoramous" non-perjorativel then, but the fact is, he DID at
> least
> >> >> read some AN Whitehead.  Quotes him
> >> >> from reading his book on history of philosophy, in the bowels of the
> >> >> troopship.
> >> >>
> >> >> dmb:
> >> >> And speaking of fraudulent ignoramuses, nobody around here will be
> >> >> surprised if John has tried to slander Pirsig or if has dishonestly
> >> tried
> >> >> to smuggle in a theistic view. Again. It's like a hobby, I guess.
> Trolls
> >> >> will be trolls.
> >> >>
> >> >> Andre:
> >> >> And not only that but John bases the slander on false claims he
> invents
> >> >> himself. Phaedrus did not read A.N. Whitehead at all in the bowels of
> >> the
> >> >> troopship! He was reading F.S.C. Northrop ‘ The Meeting of East and
> >> West”.
> >> >> A simple reference to page 117 of ZMM will suffice (Corgi edition).
> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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> >> >> Archives:
> >> >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> >> >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > "finite players
> >> > play within boundaries.
> >> > Infinite players
> >> > play *with* boundaries."
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> "finite players
> >> play within boundaries.
> >> Infinite players
> >> play *with* boundaries."
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> >
> >
> >
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parser