[MD] Moq_Discuss Digest, Vol 147, Issue 6
tim harris
timharrisarts at icloud.com
Wed Apr 29 13:21:41 PDT 2020
This is an interesting discussion about Florida as I just finished reading all of the John D. MacDonald novels I have on hand.
My name is Tim and I haven’t posted here before. I was reading Lila when I joined this group and soon after my joining Pirsig died. Pirsig has been the major author influence in my life and I was reading Lila’s Child a few months ago, which led me to reread ZMM again, and had started rereading Lila again when the Pandemic started. In a search to find some lighter reading material I picked up John D. MacDonald.
As a commentary on Florida his books are likely second to none. MacDonald was writing about conservation before Rachel Carson’s ‘Silent Spring’. Along with this commentary you also get a very well written story with interesting plots and in depth character development. You also get a good dose of philosophy.
I had read some of MacDonald’s work when I was young and I loved the books then, but only now has come to appreciate how good of a writer he was.
So take care and thanks for having a MOQ forum.
> On Apr 29, 2020, at 2:43 PM, moq_discuss-request at lists.moqtalk.org wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends (Scribe)
> 2. Re: Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends (Adrie Kintziger)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 13:54:49 -0400
> From: "Scribe" <Scribe at Club-Hub.com>
> To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
> Message-ID: <000001d61e4f$47c12be0$d74383a0$@Club-Hub.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dan and Adrie,
> As a nearly lifelong Floridian, (It does hurt admitting that) I can testify
> that Florida has long been home to invasive species. Dan mentions a few, but
> by far the most pernicious is humans. Today there are 10 times as many of
> them in the state as when I entered elementary school. There is a serious
> infestation southwest of Dan called the Villages where Conservative
> northerners retire with their Stepford wives to ride golf carts and complain
> about being taxed for schools. Sadly, unlike bears the Game and Fresh Water
> Fish Commission cannot open a season on them. Dan is right there a still
> many wild places here. I hope you are not too far from civilization as
> native Floridians are a wild and crazy bunch, many are still fighting the
> Civil War. As you move away from cities the number of Confederate flags
> rises exponentially as do cars on blocks, roofless trailers, bad teeth, body
> odor, and inbreeding.
> And the heat. Did you mention the heat? High 80s is a cold snap. We sweat
> from late March through February.
> As a lad I grew up across from an orange grove, down a dead-end road from a
> truck stop. At night we would fall asleep on sweaty sheets to the groan of
> big rigs grinding through the gears headed north on two lanes of black
> topped US 98. My mother still lives in the same house but now there are
> hotels on either side of her house, a McDonalds and Hooter's in her back
> yard. There is a mall on one end of her dead-end road and an interstate at
> the other.
> There was little of no air conditioning back in the day and mosquitos
> usually found a way in through the open screened windows. We took some
> grandkids to D.C. a couple of years ago and in the hall of statutes in the
> Capitol each state gets to put two statues, usually of someone famous or
> notable from the state. One of ours was John Gorrie, which drew a big "Huh?"
> from everyone. Until it is pointed out that this is the dude who invented
> Air Conditioning. Without him Florida would return to the gators, skeeters,
> and Seminoles in less than a decade.
> As you can might guess, I am not on the Florida Tourism Commission. That
> said, welcome to Florida Dan. Glad you found a quiet spot.
> We visited near Adrie's neck of the wood last year, Brussels, Amsterdam,
> Copenhagen and Hamberg.... We stayed at a hotel near the Amsterdam airport,
> which turned out to be farther away than I might have liked, but Amsterdam
> is crazy. It had never previously occurred to me that you could be killed by
> a bicycle. We went to the flower auction and Keukenhof. Beautiful places,
> and what a concept, a theme park without animation. We did stray a bit into
> the wild with a tour of a cheese/clog factory in the middle of nowhere. We
> also visited Oxford a couple of years ago to see the site of Ant's
> graduation debacle. Oh and last summer we drove through Bozeman and saw the
> buildings where Pirsig taught. They also have a small computer museum in
> Bozeman with and Apple I, signed by Steve Wozniak and one of only two
> signature in the world of Ada Lovelace!
> You might noted that my previous distain for tourism has morphed into full
> blown adoption of the lifestyle. Call it hypocrisy but in today's climate, I
> write it off to contagion.
> Starting in April we were supposed to be headed back to Europe for a couple
> of months but got stranded with the Covid. Damn, there was a tour of Greece
> in there. I was hoping for a touch of Arete, or maybe stock tips from the
> oracle at Delphi...
> It really is a joy hearing from all of you. With any luck more will chime in
> and who know what might happen.
> Krimel
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On Behalf Of Dan
> Glover
> Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2020 6:59 PM
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>
> Hello Adrie,
>
> Though there's been millions of people moving into Florida, there are still
> many wild places here where plants and animals thrive. Last summer they had
> to shut down the Ocala National Forest just south of where I live on account
> of the black bear population growing so much and possibly posing a danger to
> human visitors.
>
> That's interesting about starlings. I was not aware they are originally from
> Europe. Here in Florida there are many invasive species that seem to find a
> niche in the ecosystem and become naturalized. Water hyacinths with their
> thick woody stems are thought to have come from ballast tanks on steamers
> back in the day. Armadillos were originally brought to Jacksonville in a
> laboratory setting to study leprosy and escaped into the wild. Now they are
> everywhere. Same with domesticated pigs that are now wild boars that grow to
> enormous size. I can hear them alongside the shore when I take the boat out
> into the swamps.
>
> On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 3:15 AM Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dan, most animals are returning here altough they were nearly pushed
>> to extinction by the use of some agricultural supplements--,there are
>> many apple orchards here , and the farmers used Chloormequat for too
>> long.When i was young the swallows broke the electricitylines by their
>> sheer weight.Same story for the starlings,they disappeared for nearly
>> 40 years; only for now to come back.Yesterday we had a deer here at my
>> house,not seen in the wild in what, -50 years.!
>> Strangely, but the falcons here never left,partly because they adapted
>> to the urbanisation,and fed on domestic pigeons.
>> We also have harriers.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_marsh_harrier
>>
>> Did you know the starlings in America are immigrants from
>> Europe?...they were brought to New York at first.
>> They even have migratory behavier there..
>>
>> Adrie
>>
>>
>> Op zo 26 apr. 2020 om 21:51 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>
>>> Hi Adrie!
>>>
>>> Yes, long time. Cormorants we have in abundance too. You can always
>>> spot them perched ominously on a branch with wings displayed
>>> menacingly. When
>> I
>>> first saw them standing like that, I thought they must be angry with
>>> me over some perceived slight. Of course, all they are really doing
>>> is
>> drying
>>> their feathers since they lack the oil producing glands of other
>> waterfowl
>>> like ducks and such.
>>>
>>> One blue heron frequents the canal here during the winter. You see
>> him/her
>>> coming down out of the sky like a falling mountain. It then stands
>>> for hours on end staring intently at the water. The intensity of its
>>> glare is rather startling, eyes never blinking. Then, all of a
>>> sudden, you hear a splash and it comes rising up with a fish
>>> wriggling in its beak. I am
>> sure
>>> if I had koi, they would be long gone by now.
>>>
>>> The otters here live mainly out on the rivers and swamps where vast
>>> mats
>> of
>>> water hyacinths grow along the banks. Manatees also enjoy munching
>>> on the hyacinths as well. Last spring, a mamma manatee and her calf
>>> visited my canal for a couple days. You see them mostly out on the
> rivers, though.
>>> Same with the blue herons. Lots of them out in the swamps, along
>>> with egrets and ospreys and eagles. I've noticed peregrine falcons as
> well.
>> You
>>> can always tell them by their high-pitched screech.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 26, 2020 at 4:34 AM Adrie Kintziger
>>> <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello , Dan, long time no see..
>>>> The blue herons along with the white are a real pest here.Two
>>>> years
>> ago a
>>>> blu heron was able to
>>>> steal most of my koi-he only left one in the pond.That one is
>>>> still
>> there
>>>> now, with some goldfish.I had
>>>> to cover the whole pond with nets on a permanent base.Another pest
>>>> here
>>> is
>>>> the great cormorant which
>>>> is a special guest at the canal here.They own it!.
>>>> Few days ago the first otter was spotted in Zelzate in 50 years or
>>> so,..in
>>>> the yacht harbour.
>>>>
>>>> Adrie
>>>>
>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 21:42 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello old friends,
>>>>>
>>>>> A couple years ago I sold everything, gave away what I couldn't
>>>>> sell,
>>> and
>>>>> moved from Chicago to Florida. I bought a shack perched
>>>>> precariously
>>>> close
>>>>> to a canal in the swamps just outside Satsuma where I spend my
>>>>> days
>>>> sitting
>>>>> in the sunshine reading and taking photos of gators, otters, and
>>>>> blue herons. I was delighted the other day to see a reference to
>>>>> Zen and
>> the
>>>> Art
>>>>> of Motorcycle Maintenance in Quichotte (pronounced Key-Shot) by
>> Salman
>>>>> Rushdie but then again Rushdie seems to read everything.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am no longer writing as much as I did up north. I think part
>>>>> of
>> that
>>>> has
>>>>> to do with how it is sunny and warm and pleasant here even in
>> December
>>>> and
>>>>> January and February whereas in Chicago the weather was intent
>>>>> on
>>> killing
>>>>> me six months out of the year. I also like to think what I do
>>>>> write
>> now
>>>> has
>>>>> more quality than the torrent of words I once produced though in
>> that I
>>>> am
>>>>> most likely fooling myself.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am also exercising quite a lot these days: walking, biking,
>> running,
>>>>> swimming. I daily take a chug from the fountain of youth and
>>>>> dammit
>> if
>>> it
>>>>> doesn't seem to be working. Listening to lots of music both new
>>>>> and
>>> old,
>>>>> catch myself cranking up the volume. Miles Davis seems
>>>>> particularly
>>>> apropos
>>>>> to these long and sunny Florida afternoons.
>>>>>
>>>>> Life is good.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>>
>>>>> A rip tide is raging
>>>>> And the life guard is away
>>>>> But the ocean doesn't want me today The ocean doesn't want me
>>>>> today (Tom Waits)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Apr 25, 2020 at 2:11 PM Adrie Kintziger
>>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com
>>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Matt , and Krimel,and probably more of the usual suspects..
>>>>>> ,in
>>> the
>>>>>> run-up to my retirement and my daughter buying a house that i
>>>>>> had
>> to
>>> do
>>>>> up
>>>>>> myself (3 yrs work),
>>>>>> i halted my postings to the list.After some time it went
>>>> silent.Probably
>>>>> i
>>>>>> was peeled out of the onion. Since then, i never checked
>>>>>> anymore,
>> nor
>>>>> did i
>>>>>> hear anything.
>>>>>> So you are the first ,Matt.
>>>>>> I still read many books.I fish extensively.Still riding my
>>>>>> bicycle
>>>> daily,
>>>>>> do about 12000 miles a year.I have the bulk of time now.
>>>>>> But its difficult to ride my normal tracks under lockdown and
>>>>>> with
>>> the
>>>>>> Dutch borders closed up-normally i always ride in the
>>>>>> Netherlands,
>>> but
>>>>> have
>>>>>> to stay in Belgium nowadays.
>>>>>> We cannot fish in the canal under the lockdown,and they are
>>> patrolling
>>>>> the
>>>>>> little forest we have there , so the only thing we can do for
>>>>>> now
>> is
>>>>>> cleaning , pruning the trees and just sit over there , on some
>>>>>> distance from each other. Its our
>>>> personal
>>>>>> tranquility base , so we have to guard it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I do not know where you live Matt, and Krimel,i hope its a
>>>>>> location
>>>> that
>>>>>> allows you to weather this viral storms ...
>>>>>> Missed you all, Krimel included.
>>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 19:36 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Matt,
>>>>>>> Good to hear from you. I too have reflected on the old day
>>>>>>> on the
>>>> MoQ.
>>>>> In
>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>> memory they take shape as Good old days in a way few
>>>>>>> reflection
>> on
>>>> the
>>>>>> past
>>>>>>> do these days.
>>>>>>> I left the MoQ after Horse and Ant threaten to reveal my
>>>>>>> true
>> name,
>>>>>> which I
>>>>>>> thought was a betrayal of trust. I went to graduate school
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>> communication
>>>>>>> but dropped out after a six years as an ABD with a master's,
>> mostly
>>>>>> because
>>>>>>> I got a full time teaching gig. I mostly taught Psychology
>>>>>>> but
>> also
>>>>>> classes
>>>>>>> in Communication and Philosophy. I retired last year and
>>>>>>> spent
>>> couple
>>>>> of
>>>>>>> months in Europe riding trains with my wife. We had similar
>>>>>>> plans
>>>> this
>>>>>> year
>>>>>>> but they have been delayed...
>>>>>>> There is a serious irony for me with respect to the MoQ.
>>>>>>> When I
>>>> entered
>>>>>>> graduate school, I was averaging four or five page of
>>>>>>> writing a
>> day
>>>> for
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> community. Graduate school gave me writer's block. It was
>>>>>>> too
>>>> focused,
>>>>>> too
>>>>>>> controlled, it had to be done. Don't get me wrong I wrote a
>>>>>>> lot
>> for
>>>>>>> graduate
>>>>>>> school but it was not for fun and other than being an
>>>>>>> asshole on
>>>>>> Facebook I
>>>>>>> don't do it much these days.
>>>>>>> Anyway, love me or hate me I miss all of you, well most of
>>>>>>> you,
>>>>> fiercely.
>>>>>>> Krimel
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On
>>> Behalf
>>>> Of
>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>> Kundert
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2020 11:41 AM
>>>>>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>>>>>> Subject: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's been three years since I've checked this email and five
>> since
>>> I
>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>>> to the listserve. I was just talking to a friend, outside,
>>>>>>> 8
>> feet
>>>>> away,
>>>>>> on
>>>>>>> a fold-out chair I brought with me, and she brought up ZMM.
>>>>>>> We
>>>>> chatted a
>>>>>>> little while about it, and am going to give her one of the
>>>>>>> many
>>>> copies
>>>>> I
>>>>>>> still have squirreled away. I haven't read it since I
>>>>>>> taught it
>> in
>>>>> 2014,
>>>>>>> but I still think it is one of the most remarkably
>>>>>>> structured
>>> books.
>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>> been teaching "close reading" for over 10 years now, and its
>>>>>> responsiveness
>>>>>>> is a sign of its enduring quality of thought and feeling.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But that's just, maybe, the required nostalgic overture.
>>>>>>> The
>> real
>>>>>>> nostalgia
>>>>>>> I wanted to toss into this still pool was a Hello to any of
>>>>>>> my
>> old
>>>>>> friends
>>>>>>> and interlocutors who still receive these emails. I still
>>>>>>> feel
>>> that
>>>> my
>>>>>>> participation many years ago was integral to my intellectual
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>> stylistic
>>>>>>> growth.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I hope everyone is well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>> Former Apostate
>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> parser
>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>> Archives:
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> parser
>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>>> Archives:
>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>>
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>> --
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>
>
> --
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 20:43:16 +0200
> From: Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
> Message-ID:
> <CAFS_YJ4ZkxtLU0_g4Rzf3RR160=jvdp2nL-1Uoa-ryWt3xz9OQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> This posting made my rainy day , Krimel,-an infestation-what a mighty
> stroke of your keyboardbrush!
> I am aware of the temperature in Florida , because i visited Cuba long time
> ago,and it was smokingly hot and humid,they use factor 100 there,
> and we still got sunburn even in the shade, luckily there was always
> wind.They have mildew there , and probably also in Florida, due to the heat
> and humidity-
> indeed, sweating even in one's sleep.
> My wife is a native from Turkey, and sometimes we visit places like
> say,Sanliurfa and Mardin;even hotter than Congo, superdry, absence of wind,
> and high above sea, the temperature is dramatic there.
> Great to hear that you visited the Keukenhof , Krimel , i was there two
> years ago.(we have two gardens in Belgium , that are lesser known, but even
> more beautiful), and yes, people get killed by bicycles
> on a daily basis here.They are everywhere.I have all kinds, elektrical,
> race,mtb , you name it.Broke my wrist in a very nasty way, 2 places last
> year.
> sorry , short of time, have to go for today.
> Adrie
>
> Op wo 29 apr. 2020 om 19:56 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com>:
>
>> Dan and Adrie,
>> As a nearly lifelong Floridian, (It does hurt admitting that) I can testify
>> that Florida has long been home to invasive species. Dan mentions a few,
>> but
>> by far the most pernicious is humans. Today there are 10 times as many of
>> them in the state as when I entered elementary school. There is a serious
>> infestation southwest of Dan called the Villages where Conservative
>> northerners retire with their Stepford wives to ride golf carts and
>> complain
>> about being taxed for schools. Sadly, unlike bears the Game and Fresh Water
>> Fish Commission cannot open a season on them. Dan is right there a still
>> many wild places here. I hope you are not too far from civilization as
>> native Floridians are a wild and crazy bunch, many are still fighting the
>> Civil War. As you move away from cities the number of Confederate flags
>> rises exponentially as do cars on blocks, roofless trailers, bad teeth,
>> body
>> odor, and inbreeding.
>> And the heat. Did you mention the heat? High 80s is a cold snap. We sweat
>> from late March through February.
>> As a lad I grew up across from an orange grove, down a dead-end road from a
>> truck stop. At night we would fall asleep on sweaty sheets to the groan of
>> big rigs grinding through the gears headed north on two lanes of black
>> topped US 98. My mother still lives in the same house but now there are
>> hotels on either side of her house, a McDonalds and Hooter's in her back
>> yard. There is a mall on one end of her dead-end road and an interstate at
>> the other.
>> There was little of no air conditioning back in the day and mosquitos
>> usually found a way in through the open screened windows. We took some
>> grandkids to D.C. a couple of years ago and in the hall of statutes in the
>> Capitol each state gets to put two statues, usually of someone famous or
>> notable from the state. One of ours was John Gorrie, which drew a big
>> "Huh?"
>> from everyone. Until it is pointed out that this is the dude who invented
>> Air Conditioning. Without him Florida would return to the gators, skeeters,
>> and Seminoles in less than a decade.
>> As you can might guess, I am not on the Florida Tourism Commission. That
>> said, welcome to Florida Dan. Glad you found a quiet spot.
>> We visited near Adrie's neck of the wood last year, Brussels, Amsterdam,
>> Copenhagen and Hamberg.... We stayed at a hotel near the Amsterdam airport,
>> which turned out to be farther away than I might have liked, but Amsterdam
>> is crazy. It had never previously occurred to me that you could be killed
>> by
>> a bicycle. We went to the flower auction and Keukenhof. Beautiful places,
>> and what a concept, a theme park without animation. We did stray a bit into
>> the wild with a tour of a cheese/clog factory in the middle of nowhere. We
>> also visited Oxford a couple of years ago to see the site of Ant's
>> graduation debacle. Oh and last summer we drove through Bozeman and saw the
>> buildings where Pirsig taught. They also have a small computer museum in
>> Bozeman with and Apple I, signed by Steve Wozniak and one of only two
>> signature in the world of Ada Lovelace!
>> You might noted that my previous distain for tourism has morphed into full
>> blown adoption of the lifestyle. Call it hypocrisy but in today's climate,
>> I
>> write it off to contagion.
>> Starting in April we were supposed to be headed back to Europe for a couple
>> of months but got stranded with the Covid. Damn, there was a tour of Greece
>> in there. I was hoping for a touch of Arete, or maybe stock tips from the
>> oracle at Delphi...
>> It really is a joy hearing from all of you. With any luck more will chime
>> in
>> and who know what might happen.
>> Krimel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On Behalf Of Dan
>> Glover
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2020 6:59 PM
>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>
>> Hello Adrie,
>>
>> Though there's been millions of people moving into Florida, there are still
>> many wild places here where plants and animals thrive. Last summer they had
>> to shut down the Ocala National Forest just south of where I live on
>> account
>> of the black bear population growing so much and possibly posing a danger
>> to
>> human visitors.
>>
>> That's interesting about starlings. I was not aware they are originally
>> from
>> Europe. Here in Florida there are many invasive species that seem to find a
>> niche in the ecosystem and become naturalized. Water hyacinths with their
>> thick woody stems are thought to have come from ballast tanks on steamers
>> back in the day. Armadillos were originally brought to Jacksonville in a
>> laboratory setting to study leprosy and escaped into the wild. Now they are
>> everywhere. Same with domesticated pigs that are now wild boars that grow
>> to
>> enormous size. I can hear them alongside the shore when I take the boat out
>> into the swamps.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 3:15 AM Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dan, most animals are returning here altough they were nearly pushed
>>> to extinction by the use of some agricultural supplements--,there are
>>> many apple orchards here , and the farmers used Chloormequat for too
>>> long.When i was young the swallows broke the electricitylines by their
>>> sheer weight.Same story for the starlings,they disappeared for nearly
>>> 40 years; only for now to come back.Yesterday we had a deer here at my
>>> house,not seen in the wild in what, -50 years.!
>>> Strangely, but the falcons here never left,partly because they adapted
>>> to the urbanisation,and fed on domestic pigeons.
>>> We also have harriers.
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_marsh_harrier
>>>
>>> Did you know the starlings in America are immigrants from
>>> Europe?...they were brought to New York at first.
>>> They even have migratory behavier there..
>>>
>>> Adrie
>>>
>>>
>>> Op zo 26 apr. 2020 om 21:51 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>>
>>>> Hi Adrie!
>>>>
>>>> Yes, long time. Cormorants we have in abundance too. You can always
>>>> spot them perched ominously on a branch with wings displayed
>>>> menacingly. When
>>> I
>>>> first saw them standing like that, I thought they must be angry with
>>>> me over some perceived slight. Of course, all they are really doing
>>>> is
>>> drying
>>>> their feathers since they lack the oil producing glands of other
>>> waterfowl
>>>> like ducks and such.
>>>>
>>>> One blue heron frequents the canal here during the winter. You see
>>> him/her
>>>> coming down out of the sky like a falling mountain. It then stands
>>>> for hours on end staring intently at the water. The intensity of its
>>>> glare is rather startling, eyes never blinking. Then, all of a
>>>> sudden, you hear a splash and it comes rising up with a fish
>>>> wriggling in its beak. I am
>>> sure
>>>> if I had koi, they would be long gone by now.
>>>>
>>>> The otters here live mainly out on the rivers and swamps where vast
>>>> mats
>>> of
>>>> water hyacinths grow along the banks. Manatees also enjoy munching
>>>> on the hyacinths as well. Last spring, a mamma manatee and her calf
>>>> visited my canal for a couple days. You see them mostly out on the
>> rivers, though.
>>>> Same with the blue herons. Lots of them out in the swamps, along
>>>> with egrets and ospreys and eagles. I've noticed peregrine falcons as
>> well.
>>> You
>>>> can always tell them by their high-pitched screech.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Apr 26, 2020 at 4:34 AM Adrie Kintziger
>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello , Dan, long time no see..
>>>>> The blue herons along with the white are a real pest here.Two
>>>>> years
>>> ago a
>>>>> blu heron was able to
>>>>> steal most of my koi-he only left one in the pond.That one is
>>>>> still
>>> there
>>>>> now, with some goldfish.I had
>>>>> to cover the whole pond with nets on a permanent base.Another pest
>>>>> here
>>>> is
>>>>> the great cormorant which
>>>>> is a special guest at the canal here.They own it!.
>>>>> Few days ago the first otter was spotted in Zelzate in 50 years or
>>>> so,..in
>>>>> the yacht harbour.
>>>>>
>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>
>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 21:42 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com
>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello old friends,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A couple years ago I sold everything, gave away what I couldn't
>>>>>> sell,
>>>> and
>>>>>> moved from Chicago to Florida. I bought a shack perched
>>>>>> precariously
>>>>> close
>>>>>> to a canal in the swamps just outside Satsuma where I spend my
>>>>>> days
>>>>> sitting
>>>>>> in the sunshine reading and taking photos of gators, otters, and
>>>>>> blue herons. I was delighted the other day to see a reference to
>>>>>> Zen and
>>> the
>>>>> Art
>>>>>> of Motorcycle Maintenance in Quichotte (pronounced Key-Shot) by
>>> Salman
>>>>>> Rushdie but then again Rushdie seems to read everything.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am no longer writing as much as I did up north. I think part
>>>>>> of
>>> that
>>>>> has
>>>>>> to do with how it is sunny and warm and pleasant here even in
>>> December
>>>>> and
>>>>>> January and February whereas in Chicago the weather was intent
>>>>>> on
>>>> killing
>>>>>> me six months out of the year. I also like to think what I do
>>>>>> write
>>> now
>>>>> has
>>>>>> more quality than the torrent of words I once produced though in
>>> that I
>>>>> am
>>>>>> most likely fooling myself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am also exercising quite a lot these days: walking, biking,
>>> running,
>>>>>> swimming. I daily take a chug from the fountain of youth and
>>>>>> dammit
>>> if
>>>> it
>>>>>> doesn't seem to be working. Listening to lots of music both new
>>>>>> and
>>>> old,
>>>>>> catch myself cranking up the volume. Miles Davis seems
>>>>>> particularly
>>>>> apropos
>>>>>> to these long and sunny Florida afternoons.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Life is good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A rip tide is raging
>>>>>> And the life guard is away
>>>>>> But the ocean doesn't want me today The ocean doesn't want me
>>>>>> today (Tom Waits)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 25, 2020 at 2:11 PM Adrie Kintziger
>>>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Matt , and Krimel,and probably more of the usual suspects..
>>>>>>> ,in
>>>> the
>>>>>>> run-up to my retirement and my daughter buying a house that i
>>>>>>> had
>>> to
>>>> do
>>>>>> up
>>>>>>> myself (3 yrs work),
>>>>>>> i halted my postings to the list.After some time it went
>>>>> silent.Probably
>>>>>> i
>>>>>>> was peeled out of the onion. Since then, i never checked
>>>>>>> anymore,
>>> nor
>>>>>> did i
>>>>>>> hear anything.
>>>>>>> So you are the first ,Matt.
>>>>>>> I still read many books.I fish extensively.Still riding my
>>>>>>> bicycle
>>>>> daily,
>>>>>>> do about 12000 miles a year.I have the bulk of time now.
>>>>>>> But its difficult to ride my normal tracks under lockdown and
>>>>>>> with
>>>> the
>>>>>>> Dutch borders closed up-normally i always ride in the
>>>>>>> Netherlands,
>>>> but
>>>>>> have
>>>>>>> to stay in Belgium nowadays.
>>>>>>> We cannot fish in the canal under the lockdown,and they are
>>>> patrolling
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> little forest we have there , so the only thing we can do for
>>>>>>> now
>>> is
>>>>>>> cleaning , pruning the trees and just sit over there , on some
>>>>>>> distance from each other. Its our
>>>>> personal
>>>>>>> tranquility base , so we have to guard it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I do not know where you live Matt, and Krimel,i hope its a
>>>>>>> location
>>>>> that
>>>>>>> allows you to weather this viral storms ...
>>>>>>> Missed you all, Krimel included.
>>>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 19:36 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com
>>> :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Matt,
>>>>>>>> Good to hear from you. I too have reflected on the old day
>>>>>>>> on the
>>>>> MoQ.
>>>>>> In
>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> memory they take shape as Good old days in a way few
>>>>>>>> reflection
>>> on
>>>>> the
>>>>>>> past
>>>>>>>> do these days.
>>>>>>>> I left the MoQ after Horse and Ant threaten to reveal my
>>>>>>>> true
>>> name,
>>>>>>> which I
>>>>>>>> thought was a betrayal of trust. I went to graduate school
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> communication
>>>>>>>> but dropped out after a six years as an ABD with a master's,
>>> mostly
>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>>> I got a full time teaching gig. I mostly taught Psychology
>>>>>>>> but
>>> also
>>>>>>> classes
>>>>>>>> in Communication and Philosophy. I retired last year and
>>>>>>>> spent
>>>> couple
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> months in Europe riding trains with my wife. We had similar
>>>>>>>> plans
>>>>> this
>>>>>>> year
>>>>>>>> but they have been delayed...
>>>>>>>> There is a serious irony for me with respect to the MoQ.
>>>>>>>> When I
>>>>> entered
>>>>>>>> graduate school, I was averaging four or five page of
>>>>>>>> writing a
>>> day
>>>>> for
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> community. Graduate school gave me writer's block. It was
>>>>>>>> too
>>>>> focused,
>>>>>>> too
>>>>>>>> controlled, it had to be done. Don't get me wrong I wrote a
>>>>>>>> lot
>>> for
>>>>>>>> graduate
>>>>>>>> school but it was not for fun and other than being an
>>>>>>>> asshole on
>>>>>>> Facebook I
>>>>>>>> don't do it much these days.
>>>>>>>> Anyway, love me or hate me I miss all of you, well most of
>>>>>>>> you,
>>>>>> fiercely.
>>>>>>>> Krimel
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On
>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of
>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>> Kundert
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2020 11:41 AM
>>>>>>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's been three years since I've checked this email and five
>>> since
>>>> I
>>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>>>> to the listserve. I was just talking to a friend, outside,
>>>>>>>> 8
>>> feet
>>>>>> away,
>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> a fold-out chair I brought with me, and she brought up ZMM.
>>>>>>>> We
>>>>>> chatted a
>>>>>>>> little while about it, and am going to give her one of the
>>>>>>>> many
>>>>> copies
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> still have squirreled away. I haven't read it since I
>>>>>>>> taught it
>>> in
>>>>>> 2014,
>>>>>>>> but I still think it is one of the most remarkably
>>>>>>>> structured
>>>> books.
>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>> been teaching "close reading" for over 10 years now, and its
>>>>>>> responsiveness
>>>>>>>> is a sign of its enduring quality of thought and feeling.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But that's just, maybe, the required nostalgic overture.
>>>>>>>> The
>>> real
>>>>>>>> nostalgia
>>>>>>>> I wanted to toss into this still pool was a Hello to any of
>>>>>>>> my
>>> old
>>>>>>> friends
>>>>>>>> and interlocutors who still receive these emails. I still
>>>>>>>> feel
>>>> that
>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> participation many years ago was integral to my intellectual
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> stylistic
>>>>>>>> growth.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I hope everyone is well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>> Former Apostate
>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> parser
>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> parser
>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>> Archives:
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>> Archives:
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>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> parser
>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>> Archives:
>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> http://www.danglover.com
>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>> Archives:
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>>
>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>> Archives:
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>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>
>
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>
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