[MD] Moq_Discuss Digest, Vol 147, Issue 6
Jan Anders Andersson
jananderses at telia.com
Wed Apr 29 13:57:22 PDT 2020
Hi all
Funny enough I also have some experiences from Florida as I spent some time by a friend in St. Petersburg and Clearwater until I ended up in New Orleans by some strange Cajun women….
If you ever, by accident or what, find your self fooling around in Europe, in some Post-Corona period, you should remember that you’re always welcome to visit me and my wife.
We’re living in an old railway station just halfway between Oslo and Stockholm.
bw
Jan-Anders
> 29 apr. 2020 x kl. 22:21 skrev tim harris <timharrisarts at icloud.com>:
>
> This is an interesting discussion about Florida as I just finished reading all of the John D. MacDonald novels I have on hand.
>
> My name is Tim and I haven’t posted here before. I was reading Lila when I joined this group and soon after my joining Pirsig died. Pirsig has been the major author influence in my life and I was reading Lila’s Child a few months ago, which led me to reread ZMM again, and had started rereading Lila again when the Pandemic started. In a search to find some lighter reading material I picked up John D. MacDonald.
>
> As a commentary on Florida his books are likely second to none. MacDonald was writing about conservation before Rachel Carson’s ‘Silent Spring’. Along with this commentary you also get a very well written story with interesting plots and in depth character development. You also get a good dose of philosophy.
>
> I had read some of MacDonald’s work when I was young and I loved the books then, but only now has come to appreciate how good of a writer he was.
>
> So take care and thanks for having a MOQ forum.
>
>
>> On Apr 29, 2020, at 2:43 PM, moq_discuss-request at lists.moqtalk.org wrote:
>>
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>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends (Scribe)
>> 2. Re: Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends (Adrie Kintziger)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 13:54:49 -0400
>> From: "Scribe" <Scribe at Club-Hub.com>
>> To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
>> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>> Message-ID: <000001d61e4f$47c12be0$d74383a0$@Club-Hub.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Dan and Adrie,
>> As a nearly lifelong Floridian, (It does hurt admitting that) I can testify
>> that Florida has long been home to invasive species. Dan mentions a few, but
>> by far the most pernicious is humans. Today there are 10 times as many of
>> them in the state as when I entered elementary school. There is a serious
>> infestation southwest of Dan called the Villages where Conservative
>> northerners retire with their Stepford wives to ride golf carts and complain
>> about being taxed for schools. Sadly, unlike bears the Game and Fresh Water
>> Fish Commission cannot open a season on them. Dan is right there a still
>> many wild places here. I hope you are not too far from civilization as
>> native Floridians are a wild and crazy bunch, many are still fighting the
>> Civil War. As you move away from cities the number of Confederate flags
>> rises exponentially as do cars on blocks, roofless trailers, bad teeth, body
>> odor, and inbreeding.
>> And the heat. Did you mention the heat? High 80s is a cold snap. We sweat
>> from late March through February.
>> As a lad I grew up across from an orange grove, down a dead-end road from a
>> truck stop. At night we would fall asleep on sweaty sheets to the groan of
>> big rigs grinding through the gears headed north on two lanes of black
>> topped US 98. My mother still lives in the same house but now there are
>> hotels on either side of her house, a McDonalds and Hooter's in her back
>> yard. There is a mall on one end of her dead-end road and an interstate at
>> the other.
>> There was little of no air conditioning back in the day and mosquitos
>> usually found a way in through the open screened windows. We took some
>> grandkids to D.C. a couple of years ago and in the hall of statutes in the
>> Capitol each state gets to put two statues, usually of someone famous or
>> notable from the state. One of ours was John Gorrie, which drew a big "Huh?"
>> from everyone. Until it is pointed out that this is the dude who invented
>> Air Conditioning. Without him Florida would return to the gators, skeeters,
>> and Seminoles in less than a decade.
>> As you can might guess, I am not on the Florida Tourism Commission. That
>> said, welcome to Florida Dan. Glad you found a quiet spot.
>> We visited near Adrie's neck of the wood last year, Brussels, Amsterdam,
>> Copenhagen and Hamberg.... We stayed at a hotel near the Amsterdam airport,
>> which turned out to be farther away than I might have liked, but Amsterdam
>> is crazy. It had never previously occurred to me that you could be killed by
>> a bicycle. We went to the flower auction and Keukenhof. Beautiful places,
>> and what a concept, a theme park without animation. We did stray a bit into
>> the wild with a tour of a cheese/clog factory in the middle of nowhere. We
>> also visited Oxford a couple of years ago to see the site of Ant's
>> graduation debacle. Oh and last summer we drove through Bozeman and saw the
>> buildings where Pirsig taught. They also have a small computer museum in
>> Bozeman with and Apple I, signed by Steve Wozniak and one of only two
>> signature in the world of Ada Lovelace!
>> You might noted that my previous distain for tourism has morphed into full
>> blown adoption of the lifestyle. Call it hypocrisy but in today's climate, I
>> write it off to contagion.
>> Starting in April we were supposed to be headed back to Europe for a couple
>> of months but got stranded with the Covid. Damn, there was a tour of Greece
>> in there. I was hoping for a touch of Arete, or maybe stock tips from the
>> oracle at Delphi...
>> It really is a joy hearing from all of you. With any luck more will chime in
>> and who know what might happen.
>> Krimel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On Behalf Of Dan
>> Glover
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2020 6:59 PM
>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>
>> Hello Adrie,
>>
>> Though there's been millions of people moving into Florida, there are still
>> many wild places here where plants and animals thrive. Last summer they had
>> to shut down the Ocala National Forest just south of where I live on account
>> of the black bear population growing so much and possibly posing a danger to
>> human visitors.
>>
>> That's interesting about starlings. I was not aware they are originally from
>> Europe. Here in Florida there are many invasive species that seem to find a
>> niche in the ecosystem and become naturalized. Water hyacinths with their
>> thick woody stems are thought to have come from ballast tanks on steamers
>> back in the day. Armadillos were originally brought to Jacksonville in a
>> laboratory setting to study leprosy and escaped into the wild. Now they are
>> everywhere. Same with domesticated pigs that are now wild boars that grow to
>> enormous size. I can hear them alongside the shore when I take the boat out
>> into the swamps.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 3:15 AM Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dan, most animals are returning here altough they were nearly pushed
>>> to extinction by the use of some agricultural supplements--,there are
>>> many apple orchards here , and the farmers used Chloormequat for too
>>> long.When i was young the swallows broke the electricitylines by their
>>> sheer weight.Same story for the starlings,they disappeared for nearly
>>> 40 years; only for now to come back.Yesterday we had a deer here at my
>>> house,not seen in the wild in what, -50 years.!
>>> Strangely, but the falcons here never left,partly because they adapted
>>> to the urbanisation,and fed on domestic pigeons.
>>> We also have harriers.
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_marsh_harrier
>>>
>>> Did you know the starlings in America are immigrants from
>>> Europe?...they were brought to New York at first.
>>> They even have migratory behavier there..
>>>
>>> Adrie
>>>
>>>
>>> Op zo 26 apr. 2020 om 21:51 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>>
>>>> Hi Adrie!
>>>>
>>>> Yes, long time. Cormorants we have in abundance too. You can always
>>>> spot them perched ominously on a branch with wings displayed
>>>> menacingly. When
>>> I
>>>> first saw them standing like that, I thought they must be angry with
>>>> me over some perceived slight. Of course, all they are really doing
>>>> is
>>> drying
>>>> their feathers since they lack the oil producing glands of other
>>> waterfowl
>>>> like ducks and such.
>>>>
>>>> One blue heron frequents the canal here during the winter. You see
>>> him/her
>>>> coming down out of the sky like a falling mountain. It then stands
>>>> for hours on end staring intently at the water. The intensity of its
>>>> glare is rather startling, eyes never blinking. Then, all of a
>>>> sudden, you hear a splash and it comes rising up with a fish
>>>> wriggling in its beak. I am
>>> sure
>>>> if I had koi, they would be long gone by now.
>>>>
>>>> The otters here live mainly out on the rivers and swamps where vast
>>>> mats
>>> of
>>>> water hyacinths grow along the banks. Manatees also enjoy munching
>>>> on the hyacinths as well. Last spring, a mamma manatee and her calf
>>>> visited my canal for a couple days. You see them mostly out on the
>> rivers, though.
>>>> Same with the blue herons. Lots of them out in the swamps, along
>>>> with egrets and ospreys and eagles. I've noticed peregrine falcons as
>> well.
>>> You
>>>> can always tell them by their high-pitched screech.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Apr 26, 2020 at 4:34 AM Adrie Kintziger
>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello , Dan, long time no see..
>>>>> The blue herons along with the white are a real pest here.Two
>>>>> years
>>> ago a
>>>>> blu heron was able to
>>>>> steal most of my koi-he only left one in the pond.That one is
>>>>> still
>>> there
>>>>> now, with some goldfish.I had
>>>>> to cover the whole pond with nets on a permanent base.Another pest
>>>>> here
>>>> is
>>>>> the great cormorant which
>>>>> is a special guest at the canal here.They own it!.
>>>>> Few days ago the first otter was spotted in Zelzate in 50 years or
>>>> so,..in
>>>>> the yacht harbour.
>>>>>
>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>
>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 21:42 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello old friends,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A couple years ago I sold everything, gave away what I couldn't
>>>>>> sell,
>>>> and
>>>>>> moved from Chicago to Florida. I bought a shack perched
>>>>>> precariously
>>>>> close
>>>>>> to a canal in the swamps just outside Satsuma where I spend my
>>>>>> days
>>>>> sitting
>>>>>> in the sunshine reading and taking photos of gators, otters, and
>>>>>> blue herons. I was delighted the other day to see a reference to
>>>>>> Zen and
>>> the
>>>>> Art
>>>>>> of Motorcycle Maintenance in Quichotte (pronounced Key-Shot) by
>>> Salman
>>>>>> Rushdie but then again Rushdie seems to read everything.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am no longer writing as much as I did up north. I think part
>>>>>> of
>>> that
>>>>> has
>>>>>> to do with how it is sunny and warm and pleasant here even in
>>> December
>>>>> and
>>>>>> January and February whereas in Chicago the weather was intent
>>>>>> on
>>>> killing
>>>>>> me six months out of the year. I also like to think what I do
>>>>>> write
>>> now
>>>>> has
>>>>>> more quality than the torrent of words I once produced though in
>>> that I
>>>>> am
>>>>>> most likely fooling myself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am also exercising quite a lot these days: walking, biking,
>>> running,
>>>>>> swimming. I daily take a chug from the fountain of youth and
>>>>>> dammit
>>> if
>>>> it
>>>>>> doesn't seem to be working. Listening to lots of music both new
>>>>>> and
>>>> old,
>>>>>> catch myself cranking up the volume. Miles Davis seems
>>>>>> particularly
>>>>> apropos
>>>>>> to these long and sunny Florida afternoons.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Life is good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A rip tide is raging
>>>>>> And the life guard is away
>>>>>> But the ocean doesn't want me today The ocean doesn't want me
>>>>>> today (Tom Waits)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 25, 2020 at 2:11 PM Adrie Kintziger
>>>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Matt , and Krimel,and probably more of the usual suspects..
>>>>>>> ,in
>>>> the
>>>>>>> run-up to my retirement and my daughter buying a house that i
>>>>>>> had
>>> to
>>>> do
>>>>>> up
>>>>>>> myself (3 yrs work),
>>>>>>> i halted my postings to the list.After some time it went
>>>>> silent.Probably
>>>>>> i
>>>>>>> was peeled out of the onion. Since then, i never checked
>>>>>>> anymore,
>>> nor
>>>>>> did i
>>>>>>> hear anything.
>>>>>>> So you are the first ,Matt.
>>>>>>> I still read many books.I fish extensively.Still riding my
>>>>>>> bicycle
>>>>> daily,
>>>>>>> do about 12000 miles a year.I have the bulk of time now.
>>>>>>> But its difficult to ride my normal tracks under lockdown and
>>>>>>> with
>>>> the
>>>>>>> Dutch borders closed up-normally i always ride in the
>>>>>>> Netherlands,
>>>> but
>>>>>> have
>>>>>>> to stay in Belgium nowadays.
>>>>>>> We cannot fish in the canal under the lockdown,and they are
>>>> patrolling
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> little forest we have there , so the only thing we can do for
>>>>>>> now
>>> is
>>>>>>> cleaning , pruning the trees and just sit over there , on some
>>>>>>> distance from each other. Its our
>>>>> personal
>>>>>>> tranquility base , so we have to guard it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I do not know where you live Matt, and Krimel,i hope its a
>>>>>>> location
>>>>> that
>>>>>>> allows you to weather this viral storms ...
>>>>>>> Missed you all, Krimel included.
>>>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 19:36 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Matt,
>>>>>>>> Good to hear from you. I too have reflected on the old day
>>>>>>>> on the
>>>>> MoQ.
>>>>>> In
>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> memory they take shape as Good old days in a way few
>>>>>>>> reflection
>>> on
>>>>> the
>>>>>>> past
>>>>>>>> do these days.
>>>>>>>> I left the MoQ after Horse and Ant threaten to reveal my
>>>>>>>> true
>>> name,
>>>>>>> which I
>>>>>>>> thought was a betrayal of trust. I went to graduate school
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> communication
>>>>>>>> but dropped out after a six years as an ABD with a master's,
>>> mostly
>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>>> I got a full time teaching gig. I mostly taught Psychology
>>>>>>>> but
>>> also
>>>>>>> classes
>>>>>>>> in Communication and Philosophy. I retired last year and
>>>>>>>> spent
>>>> couple
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> months in Europe riding trains with my wife. We had similar
>>>>>>>> plans
>>>>> this
>>>>>>> year
>>>>>>>> but they have been delayed...
>>>>>>>> There is a serious irony for me with respect to the MoQ.
>>>>>>>> When I
>>>>> entered
>>>>>>>> graduate school, I was averaging four or five page of
>>>>>>>> writing a
>>> day
>>>>> for
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> community. Graduate school gave me writer's block. It was
>>>>>>>> too
>>>>> focused,
>>>>>>> too
>>>>>>>> controlled, it had to be done. Don't get me wrong I wrote a
>>>>>>>> lot
>>> for
>>>>>>>> graduate
>>>>>>>> school but it was not for fun and other than being an
>>>>>>>> asshole on
>>>>>>> Facebook I
>>>>>>>> don't do it much these days.
>>>>>>>> Anyway, love me or hate me I miss all of you, well most of
>>>>>>>> you,
>>>>>> fiercely.
>>>>>>>> Krimel
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On
>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of
>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>> Kundert
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2020 11:41 AM
>>>>>>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's been three years since I've checked this email and five
>>> since
>>>> I
>>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>>>> to the listserve. I was just talking to a friend, outside,
>>>>>>>> 8
>>> feet
>>>>>> away,
>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> a fold-out chair I brought with me, and she brought up ZMM.
>>>>>>>> We
>>>>>> chatted a
>>>>>>>> little while about it, and am going to give her one of the
>>>>>>>> many
>>>>> copies
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> still have squirreled away. I haven't read it since I
>>>>>>>> taught it
>>> in
>>>>>> 2014,
>>>>>>>> but I still think it is one of the most remarkably
>>>>>>>> structured
>>>> books.
>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>> been teaching "close reading" for over 10 years now, and its
>>>>>>> responsiveness
>>>>>>>> is a sign of its enduring quality of thought and feeling.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But that's just, maybe, the required nostalgic overture.
>>>>>>>> The
>>> real
>>>>>>>> nostalgia
>>>>>>>> I wanted to toss into this still pool was a Hello to any of
>>>>>>>> my
>>> old
>>>>>>> friends
>>>>>>>> and interlocutors who still receive these emails. I still
>>>>>>>> feel
>>>> that
>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> participation many years ago was integral to my intellectual
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> stylistic
>>>>>>>> growth.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I hope everyone is well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>> Former Apostate
>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> parser
>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> parser
>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>>> Archives:
>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
>>>> Archives:
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>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> parser
>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>>> Archives:
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>>
>>
>> --
>> http://www.danglover.com
>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 20:43:16 +0200
>> From: Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAFS_YJ4ZkxtLU0_g4Rzf3RR160=jvdp2nL-1Uoa-ryWt3xz9OQ at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> This posting made my rainy day , Krimel,-an infestation-what a mighty
>> stroke of your keyboardbrush!
>> I am aware of the temperature in Florida , because i visited Cuba long time
>> ago,and it was smokingly hot and humid,they use factor 100 there,
>> and we still got sunburn even in the shade, luckily there was always
>> wind.They have mildew there , and probably also in Florida, due to the heat
>> and humidity-
>> indeed, sweating even in one's sleep.
>> My wife is a native from Turkey, and sometimes we visit places like
>> say,Sanliurfa and Mardin;even hotter than Congo, superdry, absence of wind,
>> and high above sea, the temperature is dramatic there.
>> Great to hear that you visited the Keukenhof , Krimel , i was there two
>> years ago.(we have two gardens in Belgium , that are lesser known, but even
>> more beautiful), and yes, people get killed by bicycles
>> on a daily basis here.They are everywhere.I have all kinds, elektrical,
>> race,mtb , you name it.Broke my wrist in a very nasty way, 2 places last
>> year.
>> sorry , short of time, have to go for today.
>> Adrie
>>
>> Op wo 29 apr. 2020 om 19:56 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com>:
>>
>>> Dan and Adrie,
>>> As a nearly lifelong Floridian, (It does hurt admitting that) I can testify
>>> that Florida has long been home to invasive species. Dan mentions a few,
>>> but
>>> by far the most pernicious is humans. Today there are 10 times as many of
>>> them in the state as when I entered elementary school. There is a serious
>>> infestation southwest of Dan called the Villages where Conservative
>>> northerners retire with their Stepford wives to ride golf carts and
>>> complain
>>> about being taxed for schools. Sadly, unlike bears the Game and Fresh Water
>>> Fish Commission cannot open a season on them. Dan is right there a still
>>> many wild places here. I hope you are not too far from civilization as
>>> native Floridians are a wild and crazy bunch, many are still fighting the
>>> Civil War. As you move away from cities the number of Confederate flags
>>> rises exponentially as do cars on blocks, roofless trailers, bad teeth,
>>> body
>>> odor, and inbreeding.
>>> And the heat. Did you mention the heat? High 80s is a cold snap. We sweat
>>> from late March through February.
>>> As a lad I grew up across from an orange grove, down a dead-end road from a
>>> truck stop. At night we would fall asleep on sweaty sheets to the groan of
>>> big rigs grinding through the gears headed north on two lanes of black
>>> topped US 98. My mother still lives in the same house but now there are
>>> hotels on either side of her house, a McDonalds and Hooter's in her back
>>> yard. There is a mall on one end of her dead-end road and an interstate at
>>> the other.
>>> There was little of no air conditioning back in the day and mosquitos
>>> usually found a way in through the open screened windows. We took some
>>> grandkids to D.C. a couple of years ago and in the hall of statutes in the
>>> Capitol each state gets to put two statues, usually of someone famous or
>>> notable from the state. One of ours was John Gorrie, which drew a big
>>> "Huh?"
>>> from everyone. Until it is pointed out that this is the dude who invented
>>> Air Conditioning. Without him Florida would return to the gators, skeeters,
>>> and Seminoles in less than a decade.
>>> As you can might guess, I am not on the Florida Tourism Commission. That
>>> said, welcome to Florida Dan. Glad you found a quiet spot.
>>> We visited near Adrie's neck of the wood last year, Brussels, Amsterdam,
>>> Copenhagen and Hamberg.... We stayed at a hotel near the Amsterdam airport,
>>> which turned out to be farther away than I might have liked, but Amsterdam
>>> is crazy. It had never previously occurred to me that you could be killed
>>> by
>>> a bicycle. We went to the flower auction and Keukenhof. Beautiful places,
>>> and what a concept, a theme park without animation. We did stray a bit into
>>> the wild with a tour of a cheese/clog factory in the middle of nowhere. We
>>> also visited Oxford a couple of years ago to see the site of Ant's
>>> graduation debacle. Oh and last summer we drove through Bozeman and saw the
>>> buildings where Pirsig taught. They also have a small computer museum in
>>> Bozeman with and Apple I, signed by Steve Wozniak and one of only two
>>> signature in the world of Ada Lovelace!
>>> You might noted that my previous distain for tourism has morphed into full
>>> blown adoption of the lifestyle. Call it hypocrisy but in today's climate,
>>> I
>>> write it off to contagion.
>>> Starting in April we were supposed to be headed back to Europe for a couple
>>> of months but got stranded with the Covid. Damn, there was a tour of Greece
>>> in there. I was hoping for a touch of Arete, or maybe stock tips from the
>>> oracle at Delphi...
>>> It really is a joy hearing from all of you. With any luck more will chime
>>> in
>>> and who know what might happen.
>>> Krimel
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On Behalf Of Dan
>>> Glover
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2020 6:59 PM
>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>> Subject: Re: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>>
>>> Hello Adrie,
>>>
>>> Though there's been millions of people moving into Florida, there are still
>>> many wild places here where plants and animals thrive. Last summer they had
>>> to shut down the Ocala National Forest just south of where I live on
>>> account
>>> of the black bear population growing so much and possibly posing a danger
>>> to
>>> human visitors.
>>>
>>> That's interesting about starlings. I was not aware they are originally
>>> from
>>> Europe. Here in Florida there are many invasive species that seem to find a
>>> niche in the ecosystem and become naturalized. Water hyacinths with their
>>> thick woody stems are thought to have come from ballast tanks on steamers
>>> back in the day. Armadillos were originally brought to Jacksonville in a
>>> laboratory setting to study leprosy and escaped into the wild. Now they are
>>> everywhere. Same with domesticated pigs that are now wild boars that grow
>>> to
>>> enormous size. I can hear them alongside the shore when I take the boat out
>>> into the swamps.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 3:15 AM Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dan, most animals are returning here altough they were nearly pushed
>>>> to extinction by the use of some agricultural supplements--,there are
>>>> many apple orchards here , and the farmers used Chloormequat for too
>>>> long.When i was young the swallows broke the electricitylines by their
>>>> sheer weight.Same story for the starlings,they disappeared for nearly
>>>> 40 years; only for now to come back.Yesterday we had a deer here at my
>>>> house,not seen in the wild in what, -50 years.!
>>>> Strangely, but the falcons here never left,partly because they adapted
>>>> to the urbanisation,and fed on domestic pigeons.
>>>> We also have harriers.
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_marsh_harrier
>>>>
>>>> Did you know the starlings in America are immigrants from
>>>> Europe?...they were brought to New York at first.
>>>> They even have migratory behavier there..
>>>>
>>>> Adrie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Op zo 26 apr. 2020 om 21:51 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Adrie!
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, long time. Cormorants we have in abundance too. You can always
>>>>> spot them perched ominously on a branch with wings displayed
>>>>> menacingly. When
>>>> I
>>>>> first saw them standing like that, I thought they must be angry with
>>>>> me over some perceived slight. Of course, all they are really doing
>>>>> is
>>>> drying
>>>>> their feathers since they lack the oil producing glands of other
>>>> waterfowl
>>>>> like ducks and such.
>>>>>
>>>>> One blue heron frequents the canal here during the winter. You see
>>>> him/her
>>>>> coming down out of the sky like a falling mountain. It then stands
>>>>> for hours on end staring intently at the water. The intensity of its
>>>>> glare is rather startling, eyes never blinking. Then, all of a
>>>>> sudden, you hear a splash and it comes rising up with a fish
>>>>> wriggling in its beak. I am
>>>> sure
>>>>> if I had koi, they would be long gone by now.
>>>>>
>>>>> The otters here live mainly out on the rivers and swamps where vast
>>>>> mats
>>>> of
>>>>> water hyacinths grow along the banks. Manatees also enjoy munching
>>>>> on the hyacinths as well. Last spring, a mamma manatee and her calf
>>>>> visited my canal for a couple days. You see them mostly out on the
>>> rivers, though.
>>>>> Same with the blue herons. Lots of them out in the swamps, along
>>>>> with egrets and ospreys and eagles. I've noticed peregrine falcons as
>>> well.
>>>> You
>>>>> can always tell them by their high-pitched screech.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Apr 26, 2020 at 4:34 AM Adrie Kintziger
>>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello , Dan, long time no see..
>>>>>> The blue herons along with the white are a real pest here.Two
>>>>>> years
>>>> ago a
>>>>>> blu heron was able to
>>>>>> steal most of my koi-he only left one in the pond.That one is
>>>>>> still
>>>> there
>>>>>> now, with some goldfish.I had
>>>>>> to cover the whole pond with nets on a permanent base.Another pest
>>>>>> here
>>>>> is
>>>>>> the great cormorant which
>>>>>> is a special guest at the canal here.They own it!.
>>>>>> Few days ago the first otter was spotted in Zelzate in 50 years or
>>>>> so,..in
>>>>>> the yacht harbour.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 21:42 schreef Dan Glover <daneglover at gmail.com
>>>> :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello old friends,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A couple years ago I sold everything, gave away what I couldn't
>>>>>>> sell,
>>>>> and
>>>>>>> moved from Chicago to Florida. I bought a shack perched
>>>>>>> precariously
>>>>>> close
>>>>>>> to a canal in the swamps just outside Satsuma where I spend my
>>>>>>> days
>>>>>> sitting
>>>>>>> in the sunshine reading and taking photos of gators, otters, and
>>>>>>> blue herons. I was delighted the other day to see a reference to
>>>>>>> Zen and
>>>> the
>>>>>> Art
>>>>>>> of Motorcycle Maintenance in Quichotte (pronounced Key-Shot) by
>>>> Salman
>>>>>>> Rushdie but then again Rushdie seems to read everything.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am no longer writing as much as I did up north. I think part
>>>>>>> of
>>>> that
>>>>>> has
>>>>>>> to do with how it is sunny and warm and pleasant here even in
>>>> December
>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> January and February whereas in Chicago the weather was intent
>>>>>>> on
>>>>> killing
>>>>>>> me six months out of the year. I also like to think what I do
>>>>>>> write
>>>> now
>>>>>> has
>>>>>>> more quality than the torrent of words I once produced though in
>>>> that I
>>>>>> am
>>>>>>> most likely fooling myself.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am also exercising quite a lot these days: walking, biking,
>>>> running,
>>>>>>> swimming. I daily take a chug from the fountain of youth and
>>>>>>> dammit
>>>> if
>>>>> it
>>>>>>> doesn't seem to be working. Listening to lots of music both new
>>>>>>> and
>>>>> old,
>>>>>>> catch myself cranking up the volume. Miles Davis seems
>>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>> apropos
>>>>>>> to these long and sunny Florida afternoons.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Life is good.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A rip tide is raging
>>>>>>> And the life guard is away
>>>>>>> But the ocean doesn't want me today The ocean doesn't want me
>>>>>>> today (Tom Waits)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 25, 2020 at 2:11 PM Adrie Kintziger
>>>>>>> <parser666 at gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Matt , and Krimel,and probably more of the usual suspects..
>>>>>>>> ,in
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> run-up to my retirement and my daughter buying a house that i
>>>>>>>> had
>>>> to
>>>>> do
>>>>>>> up
>>>>>>>> myself (3 yrs work),
>>>>>>>> i halted my postings to the list.After some time it went
>>>>>> silent.Probably
>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>>> was peeled out of the onion. Since then, i never checked
>>>>>>>> anymore,
>>>> nor
>>>>>>> did i
>>>>>>>> hear anything.
>>>>>>>> So you are the first ,Matt.
>>>>>>>> I still read many books.I fish extensively.Still riding my
>>>>>>>> bicycle
>>>>>> daily,
>>>>>>>> do about 12000 miles a year.I have the bulk of time now.
>>>>>>>> But its difficult to ride my normal tracks under lockdown and
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> Dutch borders closed up-normally i always ride in the
>>>>>>>> Netherlands,
>>>>> but
>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>> to stay in Belgium nowadays.
>>>>>>>> We cannot fish in the canal under the lockdown,and they are
>>>>> patrolling
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> little forest we have there , so the only thing we can do for
>>>>>>>> now
>>>> is
>>>>>>>> cleaning , pruning the trees and just sit over there , on some
>>>>>>>> distance from each other. Its our
>>>>>> personal
>>>>>>>> tranquility base , so we have to guard it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not know where you live Matt, and Krimel,i hope its a
>>>>>>>> location
>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> allows you to weather this viral storms ...
>>>>>>>> Missed you all, Krimel included.
>>>>>>>> Adrie
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Op za 25 apr. 2020 om 19:36 schreef Scribe <Scribe at club-hub.com
>>>> :
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Matt,
>>>>>>>>> Good to hear from you. I too have reflected on the old day
>>>>>>>>> on the
>>>>>> MoQ.
>>>>>>> In
>>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>> memory they take shape as Good old days in a way few
>>>>>>>>> reflection
>>>> on
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> past
>>>>>>>>> do these days.
>>>>>>>>> I left the MoQ after Horse and Ant threaten to reveal my
>>>>>>>>> true
>>>> name,
>>>>>>>> which I
>>>>>>>>> thought was a betrayal of trust. I went to graduate school
>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> communication
>>>>>>>>> but dropped out after a six years as an ABD with a master's,
>>>> mostly
>>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>>>> I got a full time teaching gig. I mostly taught Psychology
>>>>>>>>> but
>>>> also
>>>>>>>> classes
>>>>>>>>> in Communication and Philosophy. I retired last year and
>>>>>>>>> spent
>>>>> couple
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>> months in Europe riding trains with my wife. We had similar
>>>>>>>>> plans
>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> year
>>>>>>>>> but they have been delayed...
>>>>>>>>> There is a serious irony for me with respect to the MoQ.
>>>>>>>>> When I
>>>>>> entered
>>>>>>>>> graduate school, I was averaging four or five page of
>>>>>>>>> writing a
>>>> day
>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> community. Graduate school gave me writer's block. It was
>>>>>>>>> too
>>>>>> focused,
>>>>>>>> too
>>>>>>>>> controlled, it had to be done. Don't get me wrong I wrote a
>>>>>>>>> lot
>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> graduate
>>>>>>>>> school but it was not for fun and other than being an
>>>>>>>>> asshole on
>>>>>>>> Facebook I
>>>>>>>>> don't do it much these days.
>>>>>>>>> Anyway, love me or hate me I miss all of you, well most of
>>>>>>>>> you,
>>>>>>> fiercely.
>>>>>>>>> Krimel
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of
>>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>>> Kundert
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2020 11:41 AM
>>>>>>>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [MD] Best Wishes to All of My Old Friends
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's been three years since I've checked this email and five
>>>> since
>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>>>>> to the listserve. I was just talking to a friend, outside,
>>>>>>>>> 8
>>>> feet
>>>>>>> away,
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> a fold-out chair I brought with me, and she brought up ZMM.
>>>>>>>>> We
>>>>>>> chatted a
>>>>>>>>> little while about it, and am going to give her one of the
>>>>>>>>> many
>>>>>> copies
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>> still have squirreled away. I haven't read it since I
>>>>>>>>> taught it
>>>> in
>>>>>>> 2014,
>>>>>>>>> but I still think it is one of the most remarkably
>>>>>>>>> structured
>>>>> books.
>>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>>> been teaching "close reading" for over 10 years now, and its
>>>>>>>> responsiveness
>>>>>>>>> is a sign of its enduring quality of thought and feeling.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But that's just, maybe, the required nostalgic overture.
>>>>>>>>> The
>>>> real
>>>>>>>>> nostalgia
>>>>>>>>> I wanted to toss into this still pool was a Hello to any of
>>>>>>>>> my
>>>> old
>>>>>>>> friends
>>>>>>>>> and interlocutors who still receive these emails. I still
>>>>>>>>> feel
>>>>> that
>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>> participation many years ago was integral to my intellectual
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> stylistic
>>>>>>>>> growth.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I hope everyone is well.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Matt
>>>>>>>>> Former Apostate
>>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.or
>>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>>> Archives:
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
>>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> parser
>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>>>>>>>> Archives:
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>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>>>>>> Archives:
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>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> parser
>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>>>>> Archives:
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>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> http://www.danglover.com
>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
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>>>>> Archives:
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>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> parser
>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> http://www.danglover.com
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>>
>>
>> --
>> parser
>>
>>
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>>
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