[MF] MoQ and theism

Muzikhed at aol.com Muzikhed at aol.com
Tue Dec 20 10:31:14 PST 2005


 
To the Question:
 
"Where is theism in the MoQ?"
 
I'd reply:

My paperback dictionary says theism is a belief in God, or  gods. 
 
If by God we mean a 'Secondhand God', a religious God, like a  Jewish or 
Christian God, or Allah, then the MoQ says theism clearly is a  Static Social 
pattern.   I think this is what is usually meant by  theism, so I agree with dmb's 
quotations of McWatt... nice set of  quotations.
 
The MoQ clearly says belief in God, theism, is a social pattern.
 
------------------------------
There's an interesting use of 'god' in Lila, the gods of the social  order.  
These gods have nothing to do with theism... in Chap 20 they are  the gods of 
culture...
 
" 'Culture Shock.'  That's what it was.  The 'gods.'  He'd  been watching 
them for years.  The 'gods' were the static culture  patterns.  They never quit.  
After all these years of trying to kill  him with failure, now they... were 
going to get him with success."  ...and  at the end of the chapter:  "Those 
gods.  They'll pull  anything."
 
----------------------------------
It is interesting to note also that in ZMM Pirsig uses the word 'God'  fairly 
often in natural dialog and also in the narrator's voice:    (Again, nothing 
to do with theism)
 
 "If you ever need any rope, don’t hesitate," he says. "God, I think  I’ve 
got about five times what I need here."

"...and so I suggest taking out the plugs to dry them off and air out the  
cylinders while we go back for another beer.
Oh my God no! He doesn’t want to  get into all that stuff."
 
"and then in the brilliance of the next flash that farmhouse-that  
windmill-oh, my God, he’s been here! -- "
 
"Save him a trip to God knows where to get shim stock." 
 
"It was beyond both of them. And by God, it wasn’t subjective or objective  
either, it was beyond both of those categories." 
 
In all these instances, I'd say Pirsig is "just being  sociable," not 
referring to any theistic God.  Americans talk  this way, to write otherwise would 
not be authentic.  We were  raised with "God" in the social language.  
Interestingly, though, even  in the social language, the word "God" still evokes that 
sense of the  surprise; some dynamic moments call for the use of the word God! 
as shown  above from ZMM.  Very natural rhetorical style, though, dontcha  
think?
 
...in the famous quote Pirsig uses "the Godhead" in ZMM as equivalent to  
Buddha, "the One"
 
 
"The Buddha, the Godhead, resides quite as comfortably in the circuits of a  
digital computer or the gears of a cycle transmission as he does at the top of 
a  mountain or in the petals of a flower." 
 
But here I believe he is trying to connect with the reader, not  make a 
distinction... He's trying to evoke the mystic/'omniscient' aspect of the  
Judeo-Christian concept of God: the mysterious all-encompassing, all  being, 
all-time/timeless, all everything aspect of God, which is still  a living concept in 
Judeo-Christianity, rather than a static,  micro-managing, human-oriented 
"Father" image of God.  
-------------------
Personally, though I've always failed to accept any religion, I've usually  
admitted a belief in "God" - especially when it's convenient to do so in certain
  social situations- like when you want to get along peacefully rather than 
start  a debate with a relative or spouse's relative at a family gathering.  Or 
 when you don't want to shock someone who's quite old and just wants to  feel 
that everything's in harmony.  "Yes, grandma, I believe in God."  is a better 
answer than "No, grandma, I believe in the MoQ, let  me explain that to 
you..."

 
While I now think that the MoQ is the best intellectual 'model' of reality,  
I know it's an intellectual model and most people don't want to go there.   
For them, it's easier to say that I believe in God, but have my own personal  
relationship to God.  In my mind & heart I am telling my truth in the  way I 
think best communicates it to the listener.  I do not follow a  church. No, I 
have not accepted Jesus as my personal savior!,  No! I can't  take communion and 
actually believe I am eating the body of  Christ!  No!  I can't believe in a 
Virgin birth! 
Resurrection after physical death?  I don't think so!
 
But I can say I believe in "God" - (but I know, and only I need to  know,) 
that the God I believe in is  "The Buddha, the Godhead", which  "resides quite 
as comfortably in the circuits of a digital computer or the gears  of a cycle 
transmission as he does at the top of a mountain or in the petals of  a flower."
 
 
Sorry if I digressed... I'm a rookie.
 
T Cole




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