[MD] Metaphysics

[MarshaV]

Hi Mark,

I would think that not to believe in God would be the more moral and 
logical decision.  God is a social construction taught and assumed 
since childhood.  The MoQ states that Quality is reality is experience.
Will you deny experience?


Marsha



On Jan 13, 2010, at 11:51 PM, markhsmit wrote:

> Hi Marsha,
> Yes, analogies or systems all the way down and up.  Which is of course
> an analogy in itself.  You speak of the liberty of belief in one thing or
> another.  I do not believe that exists.  Can one force him/herself to
> believe in something.  Belief exists because it feels right, not because it
> is convenient.  If a belief in God is not intellectual, then no belief is.  It is 
> easy to confuse complexity for intellect, but it is all the same, to me at
> least.
> 
> Cheers,
> Mark
> On Jan 11, 2010, at 12:04:59 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
> From:   MarshaV <valkyr at att.net>
> Subject:    Re: [MD] Metaphysics
> Date:   January 11, 2010 12:04:59 AM PST
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> 
> On Jan 11, 2010, at 12:59 AM, markhsmit wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
> Very interesting post. It kind of has the ring of analogues all the way
> down. I do like that, but in my understanding, conventionally, or statically
> speaking, some patterns are conventionally more useful than others. 
> This would make the levels more important. Should I be a "believer" in
> God because it's a social imperative? If it's to avoid being burned at the 
> stake, it might be a smart idea to state that one believes in God, but for
> any intellectual reason, then I don't think so. 
> 
> 
> Marsha
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> Bodvar to virtually all of us:
>>  
>> Yes, you bet, metaphysics in the the true MOQ sense is reality, that's
>> the very point!
> 
>> Hello Bodvar and All:
>> When I read this, something dawned on me but couldn?t give it
>> expression until I lay, quietly on my electric blanket (it is fucking
>> freezing here!).
>> Then it came to me...the passage in ZMM (I think) where Phaedrus has a
>> conversation with a priest and they are talking about the liturgy, the
>> most sacred part: when the wine changes into blood, and the bread
>> changes into the body of Christ. Phaedrus asks along the lines of;
>> (sorry I do not have a copy of ZMM with me) yes, but this is
>> symbolically..yeS??. No! says the priest, this is real. At that
>> moment, the wine and bread change into the actual blood and body of
>> Jesus Christ!
>> Christians all over the world actually and factually believe that this
>> is indeed the case. And, further more, the Bible is of course seen,
>> not as a book full of stories ( if I may take the liberty, as a book
>> full of fingers pointing to the moon!!) but as the actual word of God.
> 
>> [Mark]: In response to Andre.
>> So Andre, you believe that it is not the word of God. Let me remind
>> you that that is a belief too, no more or less than to believe it is.
>> However, your posts sounds rather righteous, as if you believe
>> that your belief is correct. How did you get to this higher level?
>> How is it that your belief somehow is more right than, say, a
>> Christian's? In fact your belief is so blind, that you think that
>> it is somehow outside the system of beliefs, somehow the right way to
>> believe. Once you realize the relative nature of beliefs,
>> that is, that they are just opinions, you may see a little more.
>> So, yes, the wine is the blood of Christ to those that believe it,
>> and it is not to those who believe otherwise. There is
>> no right or wrong, unless you believe you are God. But of course if
>> your system of belief is that there isn't one, then you are something
>> else that is all knowing, or not. There is a God and there isn't a
>> God, both are correct. No need to take sides.
>>  
>> Cheers,
>> Mark
> 
> 
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Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars...