[MD] Uncertainty

[plattholden at gmail.com]

On 24 Sep 2009 at 18:14, Arlo Bensinger wrote:

> [Platt]
> Deos that mean that there will come a time when nothing exists?
> 
> [Arlo]
> Nothing exists? Another splendid linguistic paradox! Who knows, maybe 
> something will exist, maybe not. XKCD has a relevant comic about 
> this... (http://xkcd.com/638/)... Will there come a time when human 
> perception will no longer be around? I'd say that's probable. I doubt 
> our species will survive our sun going all red giant on us... 
> Maybe... but doubtful...

Seems you believe existence depends on human perception, i.e., the 
moon is not there when nobody looks. Shades of 18th century Bishop 
Berkeley. 

> [Platt]
> So stability is permanent?
> 
> [Arlo]
> Ah, recursion. Its fascinating... This is simply a restatement of the 
> Quined.... ""Nothing stays the same" stays the same".... Or ""There 
> are no facts" is a fact"...  Shouldn't we be past this by now?

I find it hard to get past profound incoherence. 

> [Platt]
> Seems the drift to nonexistence is permanent.
> 
> [Arlo]
> Another restatement of "It's a fact there are no facts". The moment 
> you try to conceptualize in symbols this stuff, you bring the paradox 
> of recursion. I don't know what more I can say that this... Its not 
> anything new and exciting... ask Zeno... You are trying to make the 
> set contain itself. Can't be done without some paradox creeping in 
> somewhere... Would a real Zen Master just say "mu" to this? Perhaps...

Is it possible to conceptualize in something other than symbols?

> [Platt]
> Seems you assume time is permanent..
> 
> [Arlo]
> Not in a million years (pun intended).

Between us another permanent disagreement. (Pun intended)