[MD] "Could have acted differently" v. "the extent to which we perceive DQ"

[Dan Glover]

Hello everyone

On Sat, Sep 10, 2011 at 5:24 PM, ARLO J BENSINGER JR <ajb102 at psu.edu> wrote:
> [Dan]
> I would say they are both.
>
> [Arlo]
> I don't know, you are saying (if I understand) there is DQ and there are
> illusions. Nothing else. So you'd support calling SQ, perhaps, "inorganic
> illusions, biological illusions, social illusions and intellectual illusions"?

Dan:

I believe I said that free will and "could have acted differently" are
seen as static quality illusions in the MOQ. You seem to be twisting
my words into something that I did not say. If it feels better to make
someone appear foolish, by all means do so.

>
> For the life of me I can't see a single thing of pragmatic, experiential value
> that comes from this, do you really think the bombs (as Pirsig mentions in ZMM)
> that exploded over Hiroshima and Nagasaki were "illusions"?

Dan:

What do atomic bombs have to do with free will and could have beens?
Do you see where such nonsense leads?

>
> "Illusions" are the effect of S/O thinking, they are the "real objects" or
> "subjectivism" that the MOQ argues against.

Dan:

Illusions are a belief in that which doesn't exist. Believing one
could have done this or could have done that as a matter of free will
is an illusion. Once done is done. If one learns from one's mistakes,
all the better. But the belief in free will could have beens is still
an illusion... all in one's head.

>
> [Dan]
> True. It is human nature to sorrow over past mistakes. Artists use that emotion
> without wallowing in it. At least that's what I do, and I presume others might
> do the same.
>
> [Arlo]
> Well I think sorrow is but one outcome of having a temporal symbology.
> Anticipation is another. Regret and dreams, sorrow and desire.

Dan:
I guess so. If that's what you think, then that's what it is...

>
> [Dan]
> Bartender... another round....
>
> [Arlo]
> Cheers!

Proost!

Dan