[MD] aggregates of grasping

[118]

Marsha,
You mistake my intentions.  You need to figure it out for yourself, there is nothing I can tell you.

Sent laboriously from an iPhone,
Mark

On Mar 7, 2012, at 8:59 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:

> 
> 
> Mark,
> 
> Right,,, because it was a red-herring, asshole statement meant to get me to chase my tail.  No dice, Baby, start explaining!!!  
> 
> 
> Marsha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mar 7, 2012, at 11:45 AM, 118 <ununoctiums at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> Marsha,
>> I see no reason to do this, figure it out on your own.
>> Mark
>> 
>> On 3/7/12, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Mark,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Explain how you think I am using relationships in an objective fashion?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Marsha
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Mar 7, 2012, at 11:33 AM, 118 wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Marsha,
>>>> No this is incorrect, you are using relationships in an objective fashion.
>>>> Mark
>>>> 
>>>> On 3/7/12, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mark,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Static patterns of value can be understood as recurrent patterns of
>>>>> interactions that arise simultaneously.  Such patterns are not objects in
>>>>> any sense, but specific, recurring relationships.  This notion aligns
>>>>> well
>>>>> with the Buddha's The Principle of  Conditionality: If this is, that
>>>>> comes
>>>>> to be; from the arising of this, that arises; if this is not, that does
>>>>> not
>>>>> come to be; from the stopping of this, that is stopped.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Marsha
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 7, 2012, at 6:52 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Further, Mark, it seems you cannot understand the difference between
>>>>>> object and process?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mar 6, 2012, at 7:36 PM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi Mark,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It seems you cannot understand the difference between an objective,
>>>>>>> independent existence and a relative, interdependent existence?  Well,
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> shall not be rushed into presenting a Tractatus, but at the very least
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> relative, interdependent existence will not require a primary source or
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> soul.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Marsha
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 6, 2012, at 11:55 AM, 118 <ununoctiums at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Hi Marsha,
>>>>>>>> You seem to be using your patterns as objects.  Am I wrong here?  I do
>>>>>>>> not see how you are making the patterns something different.  Even
>>>>>>>> objects can change, so that does not mean anything different.  It
>>>>>>>> would seem that your are simply performing a word change from
>>>>>>>> "objects" to "patterns".  How are they different?  We see a pattern on
>>>>>>>> a rug, because it repeats itself.  That is what a pattern is.  What is
>>>>>>>> it about your patterns that provides such repetition.  How is it that
>>>>>>>> you undergo pattern recognition?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Just seeking clarification for my own understanding.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 3/6/12, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 6, 2012, at 3:35 AM, "Ham Priday" <hampday1 at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I find it interesting that our beloved Marsha, who has consistently
>>>>>>>>>> denied
>>>>>>>>>> her selfness, now denies her ability to form opinions, as well.
>>>>>>>>>> After
>>>>>>>>>> reviewing Mark's analysis of her March 4 dissertation on feelings
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> their ownership, Marsha responded:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know enough to form an opinion.  It is extremely
>>>>>>>>>>> interesting,
>>>>>>>>>>> though,
>>>>>>>>>>> and I hope to learn more.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> One can only wonder what all those quotes posted from the Vedanta
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> Buddhist scholars are intended to express if not her opinion.
>>>>>>>>>> Marsha
>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>> certainly formulated her own opinion of what a SOM pattern is, since
>>>>>>>>>> "ever-changing, conditionally co-dependent and impermanent, static
>>>>>>>>>> patterns of inorganic, biological, social and intellectual value"
>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>> become the mantra that identifies her.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Hello Ham,
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> You must have been reading my thoughts, for I have surely been
>>>>>>>>> thinking
>>>>>>>>> about you, and hoping you would find a way to do what you do so well.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I would like to comment on the term "SOM pattern".  For the
>>>>>>>>> expression
>>>>>>>>> seems
>>>>>>>>> both true and false.  The mind does seem to have evolved to reify ALL
>>>>>>>>> useful
>>>>>>>>> experience into objects of conception & perception; it is a very
>>>>>>>>> insidious
>>>>>>>>> tendency.  I do believe my definition of static patterns helps to
>>>>>>>>> move
>>>>>>>>> one's
>>>>>>>>> ideas about "objects" from discrete, bounded, objective entities to
>>>>>>>>> ones of
>>>>>>>>> pragmatically formed, recursive, interdependent "patterns of value
>>>>>>>>> (processes)".
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> And, yes, I have found much useful detail presented by Vedanta and
>>>>>>>>> Buddhist
>>>>>>>>> scholars.  It often surprises me how clearly they present very
>>>>>>>>> difficult and
>>>>>>>>> strange (to the Western way of thinking) ideas. But always I believe
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>> should continually check and verify.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Marsha
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
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>>> 
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