[MD] The Tao of Quality - Verse 1

[Dan Glover]

Hello everyone

On Mar 11, 2013 12:55 PM, "Carrie Cisneros" <7thdzr at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> hi,
> I joined recently, and have been merely lurking but this stung me out of
my
> seat...
>
> >
> > Dan:
> > Well, I suppose you could say that, thought you seem to be saying
> > biological
> > patterns are primary when you say we experience them.
> > Again, in the MOQ, experience comes first. Static quality patterns like
> > rationality and irrationality emerge from experience. They are not
> > pre-existing notions.
> >

>
> Dan, how is biological patterns different than plain old nature, and are
we
> so sure that there is no intellect or art in nature, and social patterning
> for goshsakes, so that it can be called just biological?

Hi Carrie

I am not exactly sure what you're asking here. The point I was attempting
to make is that in the MOQ, experience comes first. In scientific realism,
matter comes first. When someone says something like this:

[Krimel]
Biological patterns are experienced irrationally. They are unnamed.

Dan comments:

They are basically saying biological patterns come first, that they are
'out there' waiting for us to experience them. Do you see my point?

Now, I don't think biological patterns are different than plain old nature.
In the MOQ inorganic and biological patterns correspond to physical
patterns. We can see them. We can pick them up and examine them under
microscopes.

Social and intellectual patterns correspond to non-physical patterns. We
cannot see them. Robert Pirsig uses the example of the President of the
United States. There is no way to physically determine that the President
is the President. It is a social pattern of value. Think of the Prince and
the Pauper, if you will.

Social and intellectual patterns are human perceptions. It may well be that
wolves have a type of social pack mentality but they filter their world
through wolf senses while we filter ours through human senses.

Does that help at all? If not, feel free to say so.

Thank you,

Dan

http://www.danglover.com