[MD] Rhetoric

Tuukka Virtaperko mail at tuukkavirtaperko.net
Mon Jan 2 03:32:40 PST 2017 

Ron,

If someone can devote time and effort for researching the purported 
topic of this mailing list, it is regarded by someone else as a bad 
thing. That someone else is put off by himself having a job which 
precludes him from participating except in a mediocre way. However, 
Phaedrus's aim in ZAMM was not to define or discover or understand 
mediocrity. It was to understand excellence.

Tuk




On 02-Jan-17 13:22, Tuukka Virtaperko wrote:
> Please consider what it does to a person not to have a credible 
> intellectual authority as a child. You are implying that I have caused 
> this burden to fall upon me. But I have not caused the ineptitude of 
> others.
>
> When you are sick to death of my narcissism, you are sick to death of 
> how insignificant it makes you feel. You think you are entitled to 
> feel better. I think I am also entitled to feel better. But we don't, 
> do we?
>
> Is the psychiatrist who put me on pension making a useful contribution 
> to society? If not, why should I?
>
> Tuk
>
>
>
> On 01-Jan-17 18:01, X Acto wrote:
>> Tuk,
>> I guess everyone is being nice to you or ignoring you because you're 
>> a "man-child" with out a job or purpose who lives in his parents 
>> basement mentally masturbating to what he thinks is his own genius. 
>> When in fact he is basing his entire argument on a logical fallacy.
>> You may be a genius when it comes to logical functions but when it 
>> comes to critical thinking skills you can't reason yourself out of a 
>> wet paper bag.
>> Things aren't quiet because you are right and no one can stand up to 
>> your towering intellect . It's that you're so wrong no one has the 
>> time or energy to prove it to you and your immense ego.
>>
>> Since I have made a New Years resolution not to get involved in 
>> discussions here that I can't devote my full attention to, this 
>> tirade is basically cathartic. I'm sick to death of your narcissism.
>>
>> Grow up, get a job and make yourself useful to society And have a 
>> great new year in the process.
>>
>> -Ron
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jan 1, 2017, at 8:53 AM, Tuukka Virtaperko 
>>> <mail at tuukkavirtaperko.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> The brain is not a muscle, Dave. If you're wrong, that's it.
>>>
>>> Tuk
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 01-Jan-17 2:33, david wrote:
>>>> Howdy, Adrie, MOQers all:
>>>>
>>>> I don't know about Chris Langan's CTMU but Tuukka's criticism is 
>>>> not correct.
>>>>
>>>> The MOQ does not include anything like Kant's noumenal reality or 
>>>> "things-in-themselves" and the MOQ holds that phenomenal reality is 
>>>> the only
>>>> reality we can know. The phenomenal reality is NOT romantic 
>>>> quality. When Pirsig refers to Dynamic Quality as "direct everyday 
>>>> experience," "the primary empirical reality," or quotes William 
>>>> James referring to "the immediate flux of reality," and "pure 
>>>> experience" he is talking about phenomenal reality as such.
>>>>
>>>> Tuukka's claims to have improved the MOQ are quite preposterous. 
>>>> Obviously, there's no way to "improve" the MOQ or create an 
>>>> alternative without understanding it first.
>>>>
>>>> Buyer beware.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: Moq_Discuss <moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org> on behalf 
>>>> of Adrie Kintziger <parser666 at gmail.com>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 6:43 AM
>>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [MD] Rhetoric
>>>>
>>>> I think its good to read these materials.But things on wiki's are not
>>>> always what they seem.Some are very deceptive.
>>>> In fact, what this author is presenting here is actually nothing 
>>>> more than a
>>>> collection of derivatives from Wittgensteins work on logic.It is 
>>>> spiced and
>>>> salted with some previously known paradoxes in a new disguise.
>>>> The best way of putting it  ,in my opinion,is to regard it as a new 
>>>> attempt
>>>> to launch the Tractatus-logico etc,....explained with the 
>>>> terminology of a
>>>> computerprogrammer, or a very strong logical thinker.And a very 
>>>> intelligent
>>>> thinker,...clearly,this however does not prove him right in any way or
>>>> field.
>>>>
>>>> I don't think it will generate clarifications on reality itself,or 
>>>> add new
>>>> insights;
>>>> it is kinda developed to work as an upide down gearbox,not shifting 
>>>> up, but
>>>> in fact , shifting down further, in a halted car.
>>>>
>>>> I wished you would not take this as critisism, because it is'nt.You 
>>>> should
>>>> explore these things, they are less boring than Wittgenstein,and he 
>>>> was not
>>>> all that clever also.
>>>>
>>>> the only part of critics i have is about your statement, 
>>>> "competitor to the
>>>> moq and amoq", There is no competion,connection,or game to win.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2016-12-31 8:52 GMT+01:00 Tuukka Virtaperko 
>>>> <mail at tuukkavirtaperko.net>:
>>>>
>>>>> Chris Langan, developer of the CTMU, which is a competitor to the 
>>>>> MOQ and
>>>>> AMOQ, does not understand the MOQ.
>>>>>
>>>>> Citing http://ctmucommunity.org/wiki/Cognitive-Theoretic_Model_of_t
>>>>> he_Universe
>>>>>
>>>>> ***
>>>>>
>>>>> On the other hand, mind acts as a filter: that which does not 
>>>>> conform to
>>>>> mental categories is irrelevant to perception, and therefore not 
>>>>> real.
>>>>> Langan here breaks with Kant, who posited a noumenal reality of
>>>>> "things-in-themselves", independent of the phenomenal reality we 
>>>>> perceive.
>>>>> Discarding this "Kantian fallacy", Langan rejects noumena as 
>>>>> oxymoronic
>>>>> "inconceivable concepts"[21] and holds that phenomenal reality, as 
>>>>> the only
>>>>> reality we can know, is the only reality there is.
>>>>>
>>>>> ***
>>>>>
>>>>> This means Langan's understanding of philosophy is at the level of 
>>>>> ZAMM.
>>>>> It is not at the level of LILA. The phenomenal reality is romantic 
>>>>> quality.
>>>>> Langan is oblivious to Dynamic Quality.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tuk
>>>>>
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